[03:27:15] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3PdfHandler: Error creating PDF on Commons: "convert: no decode delegate for this image format" (fixed in GS 9.07) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/48007#c12 (10Rainer Rillke @commons.wikimedia) https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/08/FastCCI_-_Taming_the_Commons_C... [08:06:16] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 032] Remove extra intval() calls [extensions/TimedMediaHandler] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/154073 (owner: 10Reedy) [08:06:31] (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: Remove extra intval() calls [extensions/TimedMediaHandler] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/154073 (owner: 10Reedy) [08:11:49] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 032] Fix global optout counts [analytics/multimedia] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155272 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [08:11:57] (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: Fix global optout counts [analytics/multimedia] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155272 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [08:12:45] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: via attribution link provides wrong mediaviewer link - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69956#c3 (10Tisza Gergő) Tracked in Mingle as https://wikimedia.mingle.thoughtworks.com/projects/multimedia/cards/826 [08:13:58] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 032] ignore files created when running Selenium [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155472 (owner: 10Neilk) [08:14:27] (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: ignore files created when running Selenium [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155472 (owner: 10Neilk) [08:17:29] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 032] add note on how to write tests [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155780 (owner: 10Neilk) [08:17:57] (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: add note on how to write tests [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155780 (owner: 10Neilk) [08:21:44] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Could the spacing fixes happen in a commit of their own?" (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155833 (owner: 10Jforrester) [08:40:05] (03CR) 10Qgil: "What is the status of this patch? -1, should be abandoned, or is it indeed good for a review and potential merge?" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/56402) (owner: 1001tonythomas) [08:41:32] (03PS5) 10Qgil: Slideshow Functionality [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/107023 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/58848) (owner: 10Apsdehal) [08:41:39] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Slideshow Functionality [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/107023 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/58848) (owner: 10Apsdehal) [08:55:12] (03CR) 10Gilles: Fix preference DB values (031 comment) [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/156004 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [09:31:09] (03CR) 10Gilles: Add some flow events for funnel logging (033 comments) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/144588 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [09:36:43] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 04-1] Add beforeActive and afterActive to campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155351 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [09:38:45] (03CR) 10Gilles: [C: 04-1] Add start/end and whileActive to the campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/153818 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [09:53:27] (03CR) 10Gilles: "I think that at least the language detection feature should be its own changeset. Preselecting a guessed language for users seems like an " (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/152177 (owner: 10Rillke) [10:09:36] (03CR) 10Siebrand: [C: 031] "Pretty cool. Thanks!" [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155850 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [13:41:21] (03CR) 10Rillke: [C: 04-1] "So be it. Marking it as -1 so it appears on my TODO-List." [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/152177 (owner: 10Rillke) [14:41:32] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: The link feature should provide the normal URL, not add #mediaviewer to it - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69977 (10Liam Wyatt) 3NEW p:3Unprio s:3normal a:3None When viewing an image in MediaViewer it is difficult to actually get the URL of the image. Th... [14:53:36] (03CR) 10Jforrester: "Yes, this could be retrospectively split up into steps if you wish, but it'd be a huge pain to re-do at this point. :-)" (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155833 (owner: 10Jforrester) [15:25:00] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3UploadWizard: Template redirects can't be used as custom licenses in UW, for example, {{PD-simple}} - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/40920#c17 (10Andre Klapper) This is stuck; somebody needs to be assigned and rework the patch if this is really still "high priority". [15:26:30] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3UploadWizard: UW support for other templates than {{Information}} (eg {{Artwork}}) - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/49443#c5 (10Andre Klapper) (In reply to Mark Holmquist from comment #4) > I'll initiate a conversation on Multimedia-l about Wikidata on Commons once > I see the appr... [15:27:00] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3UploadWizard: Upload Wizard rejects valid license templates - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/65229 (10Andre Klapper) p:5Normal>3Low [15:29:45] 3MediaWiki / 3Uploading: Allow &preload= and &editintro= parameters for templates on Special:Upload - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/11698#c1 (10Andre Klapper) Wondering how relevant this still is in times of Commons mostly using UploadWizard (see e.g. bug 49443 for those issues). [15:47:12] Well, *someone* has been busy. [15:48:48] (03CR) 10MarkTraceur: Add beforeActive and afterActive to campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155351 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [15:50:43] (03CR) 10MarkTraceur: Add start/end and whileActive to the campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/153818 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [15:52:35] tgr_: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/151127 is this blocked by your comment? [15:54:16] Krinkle: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/153717 similar question [15:54:32] Krinkle: i.e. have I adequately responded to your concerns [16:08:08] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: MultimediaViewer should not update the browser's URL - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/66217#c4 (10Andre Klapper) *** Bug 69977 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** [16:08:08] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: The link feature should provide the normal URL, not add #mediaviewer to it - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69977#c1 (10Andre Klapper) 5NEW>3RESO/DUP Hi Liam. Thanks for taking the time to report this! This particular problem has already been reported into our... [16:10:50] (03Abandoned) 10MarkTraceur: Add preference counts to the generated stats [analytics/multimedia] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/145595 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [16:56:16] marktraceurWMF: I've only scratched the surface of your changesets, though. more review to come tomorrow... [16:57:01] gi11es: KK [16:57:15] gi11es: It looks like most weren't -1 worthy? [16:58:23] I tend to set less -1s now, most of what I bring up isn't a show stopper for merging [16:58:26] the code works... [16:58:46] (03CR) 10Gilles: Add beforeActive and afterActive to campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155351 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [16:59:55] (03CR) 10Eloquence: "User tests so far have not shown evidence that users are confused about how to exit the viewer, and one concern is that this would lead to" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/56402) (owner: 1001tonythomas) [17:00:30] 155351 [17:00:32] Oops. [17:04:11] (03PS2) 10MarkTraceur: Add beforeActive and afterActive to campaigns [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/155351 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) [17:04:40] (03CR) 10Gilles: Add start/end and whileActive to the campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/153818 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [17:05:53] (03CR) 10MarkTraceur: Add start/end and whileActive to the campaigns (031 comment) [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/153818 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/64685) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [17:13:21] It would be good to get this done this week... [17:13:50] If we could backport before Thursday especially [17:13:54] WLM starts this weekend [17:42:21] yep, I think tomorrow it should go through. I just want to properly test it, but should be good to go [17:42:27] KK [18:01:10] (03CR) 10Fabrice Florin (WMF): [C: 04-1] "I think we need more time to review this proposed change, which we don't have evidence is needed, as Eloquence pointed out. We will contin" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/56402) (owner: 1001tonythomas) [18:04:49] Welcome back, sort-of-fellow-employee. [18:05:55] (03Abandoned) 10MarkTraceur: Exit Lightbox when clicked on Backdrop [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/56402) (owner: 1001tonythomas) [18:27:35] tgr_: https://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki-vita:Common.js#Fatal_.28.3F.29_error.2C_maybe_causing_issues_with_Media_Viewer [18:27:52] Aren't you an admin on huwiki? :D [18:46:49] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3ImageMap: PHP Notice: Undefined variable: title in /.../extensions/ImageMap/ImageMap_body.php on line 165 - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/66361#c1 (10[[kgh]]) This also happens with PHP 5.4.4 [19:01:04] (03PS1) 10MarkTraceur: Fix link to media viewer with proper namespace [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/156163 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69956) [19:01:45] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Fix link to media viewer with proper namespace [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/156163 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69956) (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [19:04:19] Looks like safe-to-ignore errors. [19:05:40] pginer: Are you in the meeting right now? Do I need to be there? [19:06:06] I only got the invitation now. [19:06:12] Organization: We does it. [19:06:58] CC gi11es? [19:07:39] If you refer to the usability testing session, you’ll be able to view it later. [19:07:43] Recordings will be available [19:07:56] So the meeting invitation is just...ugh, whatever [19:08:01] I'm going to get lunch [19:09:30] there are the following participation options: a) You can join the hangout if you want to ask the participant directly, (b) you can view the live broadcast link to view things in real-time and comment with other members of the team (in SF there will be people in a separate room watching it), or (c) you can watch it later. [19:18:56] google+ in all its glory :) [19:27:44] Yeah I'm observing [19:28:01] I maintain that if you invite me to a meeting 5 minutes after it starts you don't get to have me in the meeting [19:29:28] sublime text and shell in his app shortcuts, he's probably a developer [19:30:15] :( Chrome [19:31:21] having both firefox and chrome installed is another telltale sign, unless we asked him to get that setup in advance :) [19:31:52] True [19:32:00] * marktraceurWMF winces at Yet Another Testing User [19:32:33] his bookmarks confirm my hunch [19:33:00] Mm. [19:35:49] How did you go back one page? By GOING. BACK. ONE. PAGE. :P [19:36:25] not what most testers do to get our of MV, though [19:36:31] at least not the first time [19:36:39] *out of [19:37:02] No, but this was the file page [19:37:14] ah, I missed that [19:37:32] small screen and switching between irc and this... [19:37:51] Yeah [19:39:24] The little-known tropical Eiffel Tower. [19:39:36] there are many copies after all... [19:39:42] wouldn't be too far-fetched [19:40:10] there's a list for this, of course https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Eiffel_Tower_replicas [19:43:26] https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File%3AOrongohaeuser.jpg&diff=132698179&oldid=43373842 [19:43:30] That was driving me crazy [19:43:48] I wondered if that was part of the test [19:43:59] Heh [19:44:06] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: The link feature should provide the normal URL, not add #mediaviewer to it - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69977#c2 (10Tisza Gergő) There are three separate issues here: 1. should the embed code link to the file page or the lightbox over the file page? (bug 69539... [19:44:07] 3MediaWiki extensions / 3MultimediaViewer: Link to file page instead of lightbox over file page in the HTML embed code - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/69539#c3 (10Tisza Gergő) *** Bug 69977 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** [19:45:58] "The effects of using Coke to clean a dirty toilet" so related. [19:46:26] Preparing for a trip? Then I should be on Wikivoyage. [19:47:29] Wuh oh. [19:48:20] I feel like I'm watching Dora the Explorer [19:48:43] now find the eiffel tower [19:49:13] "The Statue of Liberty is French, that shouldn't be there" [19:51:50] This is getting annoying [19:52:02] Has this ever happened in prod? Or is it an HTTP API bug? [19:52:03] the caching issue? [19:52:05] Yeah [19:52:11] I think it's an alpha problem [19:52:27] with the generate-on-404 [19:52:33] he happens to hit a size that wasn't hit before [19:52:51] Ah, yeah, we need to set up thumb.php as the 404 target, I guess [19:52:58] the same happened to fabrice at wikimania when he was using a projector with a microscopic resolution [19:53:15] right, the 404 handler on alpha isn't configured right, I think [19:53:35] which actually happens with stock mediawiki + MV and we don't provide good installation instructions anywhere [19:53:53] (someone's direct feedback at wikimania) [19:54:36] I believe tgr_ has fixed the default experience for thumbnail guessing. I think we should do a round of making MV "just work (tm)" on a vanilla mediawiki install [19:55:28] right now it's probably deterring a lot of 3rd parties who want MV from setting up on their wiki, because they have to figure out the 404 deal, they have to figure out what template format they should reproduce for MV to pick up the metadata, etc. [19:55:34] it's pretty much unusable right now [19:55:48] Yeah [19:56:10] even if we don't find the time to improve the code, we should improve the documentation [19:58:28] just click it darnit! [19:58:44] :) [19:59:05] that part is really hard to explain to the tester [19:59:59] maybe too much information with the scenario? the connection between wanting to see all the dates and turning media viewer off isn't something people make a connection about [20:00:12] Maybe. [20:00:21] they don't know it's possible to turn it off and/or that it's "a thing" [20:00:22] And "find the dates" isn't really a good use case anyway, IMO [20:04:27] pginer: does MV redirect to the file page when disabling, but re-enabling on the file doesn't redirect to MV? [20:04:44] just wondering what's supposed to happen vs potential prototype bugs/limitations [20:04:47] yes [20:06:31] would be good to get a tester who's not tech savvy at all [20:08:05] if that's an option... not sure how the candidates are being sourced [20:08:52] marktraceurWMF: https://hu.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki-vita:Common.js&diff=15043493&oldid=15043220 [20:10:07] basically all gadgets where a function was used before it was defined are broken in Firefox since https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/152122 went live [20:10:10] Aha. [20:10:11] the rationale was to minimise the automatic transitions. I just supported the disabling because the current thing you are viewing gets removed. [20:10:31] that's probably the reason why MMV is broken on huwiki as well [20:10:34] That does not happen the other way around. But we may reconsider and support thetransition there too. [20:10:40] pginer: would you prefer that MV stays on when you disable it? [20:10:47] no [20:11:03] you just remove it, and we use that also to announce how to re-enable [20:11:16] Please tell me we're removing this from YouTube [20:11:24] alright, I just agree with this guy's sentiment that it was weird to not have the transition in the other direction [20:11:39] from a consistency POV [20:12:08] marktraceurWMF: the video is unlisted and I think he said he only wanted the WMF to have retain it at the beginning [20:12:13] Hm. [20:12:15] OK [20:12:18] *to have access to it [20:12:35] I’m not oposing that, but just as an analogy: when you have a folder open and it gets deleted you get moved to the parent, but when a new one is created you don’t navigate inside automatically. [20:12:47] (in most file browsers) [20:12:58] I should tell aripstra to make sure we remove it [20:13:18] The link is only available through the link, it is not public. [20:13:35] pginer: except here there's no container concept, it's a feature on/off switch [20:13:48] they exist "sideways", not inside each other [20:14:44] What I’m trying to say is that if you are in a place and that place disapears, the automatic translation should happen. The other way around may or may not. [20:14:59] except nothing's disappearing here :) MV could just stay one [20:15:02] stay on [20:15:13] and the next time you click on a thumb, it goes to the file page [20:15:33] it's the same on idea on the file page, the setting you change will only have an effect on your next thumb click [20:15:33] but then it would be a lot harder to figure out how to re-enable [20:16:03] yes, but you're letting the current bandaid to that problem introduce another issue [20:16:10] The transition from disabling to the file page, is telling you: this is where you’ll get and here is how to revert. [20:16:53] then you could argue that when re-enabling, it doesn't show you what you're re-enabling [20:17:00] <+gi11es> I believe tgr_ has fixed the default experience for thumbnail guessing. I think we should do a round of making MV "just work (tm)" on a vanilla mediawiki install [20:17:01] maybe you've forgotten what MV is by the time you re-enable [20:17:25] and you'll have to wait until you click on a thumb, maybe much later, until you figure that out [20:17:57] what's missing is making CORS stuff optional as it breaks setups withour CORS headers (or just document it very prominently) + provide a default set of templates [20:17:58] That is a valid argument, and I’m open to reconsider the automatic transition on re-enabling. [20:18:50] gi11es: if those are fixed, the lack of a 404 handler is not an issue AFAIK [20:19:25] pginer: something that might be worth asking through this section of the test is "where are you now?" at each step and at the end whether or not it felt natural [20:19:47] makes sense, I’ll tell Abbey [20:20:00] right now that section is a bit of a drag and by the end of it I'm not sure if we get a sense that it felt right to the user [20:20:49] 3MediaWiki / 3Uploading: Special uploadtext for the reupload form - 10https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/17194#c2 (10Lupo) André, just close this. It's a 5-year-old "bug"; I don't remember what that was about. Apparently at one time this didn't work. If it works now it's just a worksforme closure. [20:20:53] could be worth asking them to describe the different parts at the very end, to see if by the time they've finished they've understood what the viewer feature is, etc. [20:21:04] he clearly got it, though [20:21:15] but it was kind of implied and not directly asked [20:21:27] In the testing sessions, Media Viewer enabled and disabled are rotated, so on ther tests the disabling will happen early [20:21:56] In any case, I think making the user explicitly show which is his mental model will help a lot [20:22:11] right now I feel that people might be going from the disable/reenable without thinking too much about it, and maybe they end up being handheld quite a bit because it's hard to describe [20:22:44] so it'd be good to know if when they've finished they've really understood what they've just done [20:22:53] In any case, here the user used the terms we communicated in the UI. When Abbey mentioned “media viewer” he said: “The file preview you mean?" [20:23:08] yeah, and we should probably use the same language ourselves [20:23:11] when talking to them [20:23:28] In some cases the idea is not to guide too much [20:23:49] right, that's best, but sometimes it fails and it's followed by handholding [20:24:03] which means that at that point it becomes harder to see what they truly understand [20:24:34] it's fine anyway, not every task of every test will work for each tester [20:24:46] and if we don't get the info for someone, that's ok [20:25:34] the language issue we should really pay attention too, I think the previous tester did the same (refer to things based on the prototype's wording) [20:25:39] *to [20:50:35] Wow, quite a research, very data [20:54:05] I guess we should fire the research person. [20:54:35] (subject, not conductor.) [20:59:08] tgr, have you been head-down in other stuff or can I hold out hope for UW refactor review? [22:33:34] marktraceurWMF: head-down but none of it has a deadline so prod me if the lack of review on something is blocking you [22:33:59] tgr: Yeah, the refactoring patches have been sitting around a while and I'm starting to fidget about adding more patches. [22:34:12] I don't like having more than 5 dependent patches waiting for review... [22:36:56] uh, so -1-ing them for minor issues and then ignoring for another week is not helpful? [22:37:02] who knew [22:37:03] Heh [22:37:07] yeah, sorry about that [22:37:10] No problem [22:37:16] I'll look at them tomorrow [22:37:22] Yay :) [22:37:33] gi11es is already taking the campaign ones, right? [22:37:45] Also, I'm not sure if it was you or neil, but I wrote up a wiki page about the grander view I'm taking [22:37:53] Yeah, gi11es should be on those [22:38:14] that was me, thx for doing that [22:38:43] No problem