[00:13:15] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse (034 comments) [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [00:25:47] (03PS1) 10MarkTraceur: Add user preference for non-beta disabling [extensions/MultimediaViewer] (wmf/1.23wmf17) - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118648 [00:26:26] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Add user preference for non-beta disabling [extensions/MultimediaViewer] (wmf/1.23wmf17) - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118648 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [00:58:27] (03PS13) 10Aarcos: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [00:59:07] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [00:59:47] (03CR) 10Aarcos: "Took care of more comments." (036 comments) [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [01:22:06] (03CR) 10Aarcos: "Hi there team, just uploaded my last changes, takes care of some of the review comments and fixes some small issues. There are some blocke" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [05:56:41] (03PS1) 1001tonythomas: Exit Lightbox when clicked on Backdrop [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 [07:08:06] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Hi Tony," [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (owner: 1001tonythomas) [08:03:52] (03CR) 10Gilles: Make the panel animation more subtle (031 comment) [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [08:04:36] (03PS7) 10Gilles: Make the panel animation more subtle [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [08:10:04] (03CR) 1001tonythomas: "@Gilles:" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (owner: 1001tonythomas) [08:34:27] (03CR) 10Gilles: "There are already two ways to close the lightbox: the close button and pressing the escape key. Beyond that, I think providing more ways, " [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118667 (owner: 1001tonythomas) [09:03:40] (03PS14) 10Gilles: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [09:04:28] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Fixed the jsduck issues" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [09:58:47] (03PS15) 10Gilles: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [09:59:15] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Added full width divider line and rounded corners" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [10:03:02] (03PS16) 10Gilles: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [10:03:31] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Small rounded corner fix for tabs" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [10:24:47] (03PS17) 10Gilles: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [10:26:04] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Removed an !important" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [10:58:37] (03CR) 10Siebrand: [C: 031] "L10n reviewed." [extensions/MultimediaViewer] (wmf/1.23wmf17) - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118648 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [11:10:38] (03PS18) 10Gilles: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [11:11:04] (03CR) 10Gilles: "Added arrow pointing down" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [16:12:32] (03PS2) 10MarkTraceur: Add user preference for non-beta disabling [extensions/MultimediaViewer] (wmf/1.23wmf17) - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118648 [17:08:59] Argh, ffs, we don't have mediawikiwiki data since last week [17:09:46] And commons data stopped on Tuesday. Shit. [17:09:54] I hate this game [17:10:57] Are you talking about the Media Viewer stats on Limn? http://multimedia-metrics.wmflabs.org/dashboards/mmv [17:11:01] Yeah [17:11:53] Well I see data as of March 13. Am I missing something? [17:12:05] Global data maybe [17:12:09] Scroll down to commons [17:12:36] Oh, because gi11es updated the schema [17:12:43] * rdwrer scrambles to update queries [17:13:08] Ah, yes, you're right. Should we ask Dario for help? I am writing an email now about our research questions. [17:13:27] I'm jut fixing it now [17:13:40] fabriceflorin: I look forward to the research email, though [17:14:14] OK, sounds good. Will send email within the hour, once I think I have it right-er. [17:19:23] Should be fixed in about 30 minutes [17:32:26] rdwrer: Do you know if there is a table that explains what all the data points on the performance dashboards mean? http://multimedia-metrics.wmflabs.org/dashboards/mmv#performance-graphs-tab [17:32:46] Were those added overnight by g1lles ? [17:33:14] No, I added those [17:33:25] fabriceflorin: They're all times for network requests [17:34:35] Oh, OK. So if I just wanted to measure total time between the thumbnail click and the full image load, which data points should I look at? [17:38:11] rdwrer tar : I'm having a hard time deciphering the labels on the performance dashboard. Would be great if you could point me to the data that represent total time from thumbnail click (or other form of user request, like 'next') and full image display. That is the most important stat we need for overall measure of success. the first click until the viewer appearing / the blurred thumbnail displaying / the full [17:38:11] image displaying [17:39:42] Sorry, the last sentence was incomplete, but I meant to quote tgr's email comment that we try to measure the times from the first click until the viewer appearing / the blurred thumbnail displaying / the full image displaying, which seem sensible to me. [17:40:40] fabriceflorin: well, my email comment was that we should try to measure that but we don't [17:40:41] In any case, I would love to see a legend for all the data points on this dashboard page: http://multimedia-metrics.wmflabs.org/dashboards/mmv#performance-graphs-tab -- maybe put that legend on an ether pad or wiki page for now? [17:41:42] the current perf data is mostly internal stuff - i can annotate it if you like, but i don't think it will help much [17:42:12] tar : Yeah, and you also said you were not sure how to measure it. From my standpoint, the most basic requirement would be to measure total time from thumbnail click (or other form of user request, like 'next') and full image display. That single metric would be a good start, because that's what the user notices. [17:43:17] tgr: OK. So are you suggesting that I not spend much time analyzing all these data, and just focus on writing the basic research questions for now? [17:44:39] i'm sure how to measure it, i am just that we do [17:45:31] we measure a lot of stuff from which we could try to reconstruct image load time in some complicated way but would probably end up with wrong data and had no way to be sure [17:46:15] tgr: Sorry, can you elaborate on this? Are you suggesting there is no practical way to measure total time from user request to full image display? [17:46:52] i think rdwrer tried something like that with the totaltimes and the current graph, and they show a 30 sec average page load time on some days, which i would not trust much [17:47:27] no, no, there is no practical way to get that number from the data we collect right now [17:47:39] measuring it directly is very straightforward [17:48:18] Ah OK. What data would we need to collect to get that basic metric? How hard would it be? [17:48:42] so yeah, my suggestion is, ignore the current data, write clear questions, then we can select better what data to collect [17:49:31] well the obvious way would be to collect that data exactly - store click timestamp, store loading end timestamp, log the difference [17:49:59] (03CR) 10Nischayn22: "https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32606#c13" [extensions/UploadWizard] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/50760 (owner: 10Nischayn22) [17:50:01] easy to do, two weeks to deploy [17:50:42] OK, got it, thanks for this good suggestion to use timestamps as a possible way to track elapsed time between click and full display. [17:51:20] I do have some good news, though: I spent some time looking at a variety on non-popular images on enwiki today, and the experience was pretty good overall. Most images load within the 2 second maximum which I would recommend for a ‘fast’ connection — and I am using wifi instead of ethernet. [17:51:22] I realize this is completely anecdotal, and not supported by hard data, so we can’t make any decisions about it, but it makes me less fearful than I was a few days ago. Even compared to Flickr, we hold up pretty well on this computer. :) [17:51:32] it's not much of a suggestion, it is super obvious [17:51:57] it is just not the use case we had in mind when we wrote the performance logging part [17:52:58] * rdwrer reads backscroll [17:54:13] Sounds resolved? [17:54:23] fabriceflorin: Is there anything you need after tgr's clarification? [17:54:38] rdwrer: sound like a new ticket is needed [17:54:56] I'd make it if I knew what it was [17:55:10] i can make it [17:55:36] I can fix it for sure, though :) [17:55:44] anyway, i don't think there is any point in changing anything in our current perf dashboard [17:56:01] we need to change what data to collect [17:56:48] rdwrer: Yes, tgr's clarifications were very helpful. I will write my research questions more carefully based on that information. But it does seem that we need another approach to measure the basic metric I'm looking for. Sorry if I misled you in any way, it was not intentional, but this is outside of my area of expertise. :( [17:58:35] So you are correct we probably need a new card. I will also encourage the team to vet my next proposal before we implement it. Will send my email with the new card info in a couple hours, due to upcoming meeting. [17:58:52] -.- [17:59:30] rdwrer: Thanks for your hard work on pulling the current data. It may prove useful for other purposes, like in our discussions with Ops, or to drill down on details of our research questions. [17:59:47] I mean, the network requests *are* the bottlenecks [17:59:51] So it's useful [18:00:01] And it gives us the framework we need for the future [18:00:41] rdwrer: Yes, I think it's useful to visualize this to guide our next steps in technical development. So even if it doesn't answer my most basic question, I think we are learning from this. [18:02:12] I am also relieved to see that performance seems to be quite good over all our sites today. This is only anecdotal data, but it suggests that things may not be as bad as I feared. The current experience on this computer today feels quite good, actually :) [18:05:11] *nod* [18:05:21] I think the thumbnail clicks are working again now, maybe [18:05:34] They're certainly on the rise [18:15:02] * rdwrer fixes -alpha [19:01:09] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: [C: 032] "The behavior is slightly different. In the previous version, animation happened when you opened the lightbox and it has never been scrolle" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [19:01:45] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Make the panel animation more subtle [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [19:02:55] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: [C: 031] "Just a segfault." [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [19:03:04] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: [C: 032] Make the panel animation more subtle [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [19:03:40] (03Merged) 10jenkins-bot: Make the panel animation more subtle [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/115368 (owner: 10Pginer) [19:44:04] FYI I'm breaking -alpha [20:17:07] tgr: Do you have an XML export for our test wiki? [20:17:39] from a few weeks ago [20:18:41] not sure if it is a proper export or just the wikitext for the lightbox page [20:19:21] Either way is fine [20:19:28] The new alpha instance is set up I think [20:21:23] doesn't work for me yet [20:21:30] dns delay i suppose? [20:21:49] or did the domain name change? [20:22:15] nvm, it was just slow [20:22:22] It's slower because it's a proxy [20:22:25] I blame Yuvi [20:22:48] did you use labs-vagrant? [20:23:55] i ran into the same issue with the OPW project: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=62551 [20:24:03] every page load takes exactly one minute [20:24:21] No, not vagrant, just the proxy [20:24:28] also, not related to proxy at all, the apache is messed up somehow [20:24:40] hm, not related to vagrant either, then [20:25:38] can you test locally via curl and add your config to the bug if its the same issue? [20:26:48] What config? [20:27:03] And what curl would you like me to run, just of some wiki page? [20:27:13] yeah [20:27:26] the config for setting up the instance [20:27:30] curl is fine [20:27:32] puppet role or whatever [20:27:33] From the instance itself [20:27:40] Takes like -1 seconds [20:27:51] hm, maybe a different issue after all, then? [20:28:05] Probly [20:28:49] must have a similar root though, assets, api.php, 404 etc. are instant, so this is not related to the proxy [20:29:07] Hm. [20:43:32] tgr: Anyway, you can dump Lightbox demo back in [20:43:58] ok [20:44:08] but it will be pretty painful to demo things like this [20:45:26] Yeah, I don't intend to [20:47:28] seems like registration is disabled [20:47:36] or does this use centralauth? [21:03:13] (03PS19) 10Gergő Tisza: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 [21:03:15] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [21:05:56] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: "Use absolute positioning instead of JS calculations" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [21:07:09] (03PS20) 10Gergő Tisza: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 [21:07:11] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [21:07:43] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: "Match positioning of the opening link on the mockup better" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [21:22:01] tgr: Oh, I can enable registration or something [21:46:26] tgr: registration should be on now [21:46:32] Confirmed [21:50:26] Oh my god slow [22:03:07] tgr: Did you make that metrics card? [22:04:10] rdwrer: which one exactly? [22:06:58] tgr: There was a call in IRC for a new one, and I'm still not sure what needs doing [22:07:21] oh [22:07:36] farbrice said he will make it and send a mail [22:07:49] Ahhh. [22:08:10] but i can do it if you want to start working about it, it's about measuring time to display directly [22:08:22] Ah [22:08:25] I can start on it then [22:08:31] And correct if the ACs are different [22:09:19] so just get a timestamp when the thumbnail is clicked, another one when the black thing is displayed, another when the blurry image is shown, a fourth one when the actual image is shown [22:09:23] Yeah [22:09:32] then log t2-t1, t3-t1, t4-t1 [22:10:04] Yup yup yup [22:10:08] and maybe whether this was the first time of opening the lightbox since the page was loaded [22:10:44] Hm, yeah [22:10:50] Maybe this is a new schema entirely? [22:10:51] Ugh. [22:11:05] Maybe I will wait and do other things first [22:11:11] plus if there is an easy way to check if the js cache was cold (we are storing stuff in localstorage now i think?), that would be useful, but probably complex enough to be a new card [22:11:17] yeah, new schema and all [22:11:38] I'll wait to see the research questions [22:11:47] not really related to the perf schema, that is fired every time we press next [22:12:29] i don't think we can get any meaningful metric of user-perceived performance for prev/next, because of the preloading [22:12:55] Maybe so [22:13:44] although the number of prev/next clicks which are not preloaded (have to show a blurry image) might be a good metric [22:14:05] if we want to play around with more agressive preloading [22:15:00] Hm. Yeah. [22:15:31] probably another schema though :) [22:21:35] (03PS21) 10Gergő Tisza: Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 [22:21:54] (03CR) 10jenkins-bot: [V: 04-1] Add share and embed panel, replace reuse [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [22:22:06] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: "Simpler markup for the opening icon" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/117473 (owner: 10Gergő Tisza) [22:23:19] (03PS1) 10MarkTraceur: Add client-side flag for disabling viewer [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118774 [22:24:11] (03PS2) 10MarkTraceur: Add client-side flag for disabling viewer [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118774 [22:40:04] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: [C: 04-1] "* I think it would be cleaner (safer, too) to not even set up the event handlers (in mmv.bootstrap.autostart) if the option is set. We pro" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118774 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [23:14:22] (03CR) 10MarkTraceur: "Not setting up the event handlers would be good, but if the gadget (or whatever) happens to run after our code, then we'd still need to ch" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118774 (owner: 10MarkTraceur) [23:18:12] (03CR) 10Gergő Tisza: "Good point. Still, I wouldn't make it impossible to load the viewer (most people want to disable the popup-on-thumbnail function which get" [extensions/MultimediaViewer] - 10https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/118774 (owner: 10MarkTraceur)