[02:07:30] hey werdna [02:14:25] hello howief [02:14:27] how goes? [02:14:34] hey! [02:14:35] good [02:14:57] how are things way over there? [02:15:29] not too bad, getting busy again [02:15:51] school? [02:17:11] school's all over [02:17:16] a few friends are just polishing off [02:17:23] and I've got a bit of other work to do before i leave on monday [02:17:31] where are you headed on monday? [02:18:07] europe! I'm disappearing for a month [02:18:14] good for you [02:18:15] have you graduated? [02:18:48] oh god no [02:18:55] I've got a good two years left [02:18:57] minimum [02:19:05] ok [02:19:15] i didn't think you were done yet [02:19:22] quite a while to go [02:19:23] but it's summer [02:19:24] where are you going in europe? [02:20:02] bits and pieces [02:20:13] Paris, Amsterdam, Brussels, Berlin, Prague, London, and bits and pieces of the UK [02:20:21] nice! [02:20:58] so i wanna chat with you about feedback dashbaord [02:21:21] since you're gonna be gone for a month [02:21:26] yeah [02:21:35] i was wondering if you could help bring our two new devs up to speed [02:21:42] (benny and rob) [02:21:48] they just started this week [02:21:54] and could use the help [02:21:57] yep, I can do that [02:22:03] Just need to find a time [02:22:17] ok cool [02:22:21] see if you can get them to read the MW architecture document [02:22:23] i think that would really help [02:22:34] with luck, though, I can get a lot of this week's features done before I leave [02:22:47] the one that guillaume is putting together? [02:23:24] yep [02:23:28] ok [02:23:31] it's a pretty good primer for MW development [02:23:39] ok [02:23:41] good suggestion [02:24:13] so yeah, it would be helpful if you could help bring the new folks up to speed [02:24:23] and for the time you have left [02:24:28] work with them on the new features [02:24:40] i know it may slow you down a bit [02:24:49] well, it speeds things up in the long run [02:24:50] but we need to transfer some of the knowledge that's in that head of yours [02:25:07] yep, that sounds fine to me [02:25:11] cool! [02:25:20] let's see if we can get a skype / g+ / whatever session going tomorrow afternoon your time [02:25:25] ok [02:25:28] what time works for you? [02:25:28] I'll be available from about 10 or 11 my time, so 3 or 4 your time [02:25:31] ok [02:25:36] how about i schedule something for 3-4? [02:26:48] is 4-5 available? [02:27:06] i can't make 4-5, but i think the others can [02:27:15] i'm the least important person for this [02:27:17] so let's do 4-5 [02:27:26] okay [02:27:27] sounds good [02:27:31] cool [02:27:34] thanks for your help! [02:28:18] no worries [03:51:45] werdna: you're alive! [04:34:52] hexmode: I'm always alive :) [04:35:24] werdna: well, so far :P [04:35:49] werdna: while I am still awake, what are you working on now-a-days? [04:45:28] hexmode: Oh, mostly whatever Howie makes me do [04:45:34] at the moment, feedback dashboard / moodbar [04:50:03] howie! [04:50:18] werdna: cool, nice stuff lately, then [04:50:28] love the dashboard [04:54:06] speaking of, I should talk to howie next time I'm in SF about how to get the dashboard to feed into Bz [04:54:09] or something [04:54:27] time for bed [09:04:01] hello [17:39:05] hi bsitu! welcome back :) [18:44:15] Hello! [21:00:34] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Annoying_little_bugs has 11 starter bugs, half with hints -- if you want to contribute but never knew where to start, here are some ideas [23:08:21] sumanah: is there any chance that I could get core access one day? I would like to help with that... [23:08:39] I still don't feel ready, just wondering about it [23:08:41] hi petan! [23:08:47] hi :) [23:09:00] I meant the bugs [23:09:45] petan -- anyone can help provide code review in Bugzilla [23:09:56] petan: you don't need to have any kind of commit access at all to help [23:10:17] maybe, but I don't think that someone would merge my branched fixes [23:10:18] *sumanah looks at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/author/petrb [23:11:37] petan: I can put you in touch with Markus Glaser, who is looking to help by reviewing code [23:12:02] petan: he can help you get on the path to core access :-) [23:12:13] right, I could do that, but I am not sure if people who are not ready for core acess should review stuff... [23:12:40] petan: take a look at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Code_review_guide [23:12:40] petan, it all depends on bugging the right people [23:13:19] it's true that it's unlikely that anyone would look at your branch [23:13:24] ...unless you point them there :) [23:13:25] petan: Guillaume Paumier and I are working on improving http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Code_review_management/Aug_2011_training and http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Code_review_management/July_2011_training and turning them into more useful notes, but they might be useful as is [23:14:11] petan, here is my thinking: you may not be ready to say "yes, your patch is great!" but you are more experienced than most of the patch submitters, so you will sometimes be able to see problems that they didn't see :) [23:14:32] you can mark as inspected or signoff, instead of marking as ok [23:14:39] ok [23:14:49] sumanah, should a bug which is already reachable through the bugzilla query be added to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Annoying_little_bugs ? [23:14:49] petan, Platonides is talking about code in SVN [23:14:50] even commits to phase3? [23:15:01] why not? [23:15:16] petan, "signoffs" do not change the code review status [23:15:16] and you of course can make them as fixme when deserved :) [23:15:19] maybe because I am not supposed to touch code there so it sounds weird to sign off it [23:15:32] right [23:15:35] petan, "signoff" doesn't change "NEW" to ok or anything like that [23:15:43] it provides more information to other code reviewers [23:15:45] it just lists that you signed off that change [23:15:51] right [23:16:01] petan: to answer your original question: yes, there is a chance that you can get core access someday! [23:16:02] if I considered you are a jerk I'd just ignore your signoff :D [23:16:17] no harm done [23:16:19] petan, after all, no one was born with core access :-) [23:16:35] Tim Starling was :P [23:16:42] petan, no, you know he wasn't :) [23:16:48] I don't think MediaWiki existed when any of us were born [23:16:52] who knows [23:16:53] petan, it's harmful to have elitist preconceptions, right? [23:17:02] we all had to work to get where we are [23:17:08] I'd have listed Magnus instead of Tim, btw [23:17:15] indeed [23:17:25] platonides, yes, I think it is nice to have a more curated list at Annoying Little Bugs that has bugs that are easy and (if possible) to add hints on how to fix them! [23:17:44] Platonides: I think some duplication is ok and unavoidable [23:18:27] petan: there are some VERY easy phase3 bugs to fix in https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Annoying_little_bugs [23:18:45] that's where I've been looking at before I asked [23:18:49] sumanah: congrats on your famousness. I see you aren't resting on your laurels :) [23:18:57] it was sort of answer to your message [23:19:04] petan: in case you want to branch, commit a branch in SVN, and then comment in Bugzilla linking to it and marking with the keywords "patch" & "need-review" [23:19:18] kaldari: awww, thanks :-) [23:19:47] By the way sumanah, congratulations :) [23:19:56] ^ ;) [23:20:13] Oh goodness! thank you Platonides :-) [23:20:19] heh kaldari, you told it before me [23:20:36] I win! [23:20:44] petan: ah, sorry for being duplicative in my discussion :) [23:20:54] I was browsing http://femme-o-nomics.com/2011/10/the-50-women-to-watch-in-tech-the-first-10/ before congratulating her :P [23:20:56] np [23:21:48] so: to get core access, you learn. to learn, you write code & have it reviewed. to get reviews, you ask people -- Platonides is good, as are Markus Glaser, Max Semenik, and bawolff [23:22:28] code review is precious manna from heaven [23:22:59] Code reviewers, I salute you! [23:23:05] kaldari: indeed, which is why I'm encouraging people to learn how to do it and practice on each other like med students practicing giving each other injections [23:23:18] sounds fun [23:23:34] oh right if there were some reviewers now, I still need to review my extension :) [23:24:37] I was asked for full code review... johnduhard already made some review, but maybe there is still some stuff to fix [23:25:39] petan, your wording there is confusing. [23:26:20] petan, if you've asked for code review and you have received it, have you already revised your code to respond to John's comments? [23:26:23] I see it clear, although I'd recommend him to include the url to what needs to be reviewed [23:26:31] sumanah: of course [23:26:37] but I was told that it needs more than that [23:26:46] I mean more deep review [23:26:59] petan: MaxSem & Platonides would be good to ask, then. [23:27:28] I recognise that sometimes we are wary to mark things as ok [23:27:34] it's much easier to point to bugs [23:28:14] I will see if community decide to install it on enwp or not, and I will ask them ;) [23:28:37] maybe it wouldn't be even needed, in the end [23:29:31] I don't know if a review I made would be enough to get it deployed [23:29:49] I always assumed that Tim or Brion would end up looking at them just to be sure [23:29:55] that's what I got as answer on john's review [23:29:59] even if other people looked at it before [23:30:17] I have no problem to give my opinion on that though [23:30:24] I won't bother them unless it has clear consensus [23:30:26] they can ignore me later if they want to :) [23:32:06] if you wanted then, it's http://svn.wikimedia.org/svnroot/mediawiki/trunk/extensions/OnlineStatusBar/ [23:32:40] I am extremely bad with css so that probably needs fix [23:34:01] is that an extension for users marking if they're online or not? [23:34:10] yes [23:34:20] I had considered making such extension, time ago [23:34:29] you can join this [23:34:35] if you had more ideas to make it better [23:34:43] not because I find it "good", but because there are people doing them writing into pages [23:34:53] that's reson why I made it [23:35:10] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)#Online_Status [23:36:39] "Support for mono " is that monobook? [23:36:57] yes, I hit enter before I finsihed it [23:37:06] it's monobook [23:37:40] I'd propably name it with the full name [23:37:46] it isn't? [23:38:15] css style isn't, true [23:38:50] yep [23:39:32] $dbw->insert( 'online_status', $row, __METHOD__, 'DELAYED' ); [23:39:35] why not a replace? [23:40:08] I am not a mysql expert, actually, what does replace do? [23:40:20] I work with oracle every day, though [23:40:43] insert, but if there's a conflict with an existing row, deletes it [23:40:52] it's equivalente to a delete+insert [23:40:53] is it same fast as update? [23:41:09] and indeed, it's as it's implemented for backends without a native replace [23:41:25] I suppose, I don't know :/ [23:41:29] petan, if you work with Oracle, you might be interested in http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.science.linguistics.wikipedia.technical/56384 [23:41:42] the difference is that an update won't create the row if it doesn't exist [23:41:59] when are you using statusorange? [23:42:03] I work with oracle because I am employed as sysadmin for big company which use it, not because I like it :) [23:42:12] but I will check it [23:42:27] petan, understood, but that means that you have access to Oracle already set up so maybe you can check bugs for reproducibility :) [23:42:36] sure [23:42:55] Platonides: away [23:42:59] for instance [23:43:20] Platonides: http://hub.tm-irc.org/test/w/ try it ;) [23:43:29] there is this extensions installed now among many others [23:44:32] it's huggle test wiki, but I use it for development of extensions too, because more people use it, so I can try if they stable or not easier than on local mw on my desktop [23:46:08] also it has croned svn up for everything so if you make changes to extension in svn it automaticaly get update there [23:46:23] petan, I mean where is that used? [23:46:35] http://hub.tm-irc.org/test/wiki/User:Petrb [23:46:39] for instance [23:46:45] if you pick away [23:46:48] as your status [23:46:53] you will see where it is [23:47:21] if you asked about that icon [23:47:39] where do people change its status? [23:47:44] preferences [23:47:59] I sent you that link so that you can create account and check it if you want [23:48:15] I thought in a Special page [23:48:22] no... [23:48:26] people is using things like dropdowns for that [23:48:38] hi multichill, how's it going? [23:48:39] I don't know java stuff [23:48:40] but that would be easily scriptable, too [23:48:46] if someone made a script for that [23:49:08] anyway it's requested by community for that to be opt-in so it needs to be in preferences anyway [23:49:26] but script for status changes would be cool [23:51:26] what do you think on making the status numeric, and set the names with messages ? [23:51:45] bad idea, community would say it's too facebook like [23:51:54] they want it simple as much as possible [23:51:55] the internal ones, I mean [23:52:05] I think users will begin to want new silly states like "patrolling recent changes", [23:52:10] which would mean changing the code [23:52:18] kaldari: how is life in fundraisingland? [23:52:29] the interface would still be the same [23:52:38] how are numbers used in facebook? [23:52:56] I mean that idea that it could be customizable like this [23:53:17] sumanah: exciting as always [23:53:24] I don't know, Platonides don't ask me that :) I think they see facebook everywhere just so that they have reason to oppose [23:53:37] kaldari: you don't have any time to do some quick code review that's totally unrelated, do you [23:53:52] they told me that installation of this turn wikipedia into facebook, explanation was pretty weird [23:53:57] No, I'm actually behind in my fundraising code review :( [23:54:59] got it kaldari [23:55:03] that's what I assumed. [23:55:23] btw Platonides it's 1 am here, if you have any ideas feel free to change it in trunk, or even insert your name to about, I don't care [23:55:33] I need to sleep :P [23:55:46] we're in the same timezone :P [23:55:51] really? :) [23:55:52] good night [23:55:56] yes [23:55:59] where are you from? [23:56:02] you don't have to wake up early? [23:56:05] czech republic [23:56:10] Spain [23:56:13] cool [23:56:37] petan, are you coming to any upcoming dev meetups? [23:56:44] I'd love to! [23:57:06] petan, https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki_developer_meetings [23:57:19] Maryana already invited me to some London conference (not sure if dev) but I didn't have time for that, anyway if there was some in europe, I would [23:57:29] petan, Brighton in the UK is coming up on the 19th [23:57:39] petan, and you can host one yourself of course if you want [23:58:01] petan, you & Danny B would both attend for sure :-) [23:58:01] you know, attending those are sort of expensive for me, but I will consider that [23:58:24] Danny B is from where? [23:58:27] bsitu / rmoen: You around? [23:58:29] petan, I'm almost always on irc (though not always in front of the keyboard xD) [23:58:33] feel free to poke me [23:58:41] petan, Danny B. is in the Czech Republic [23:58:50] good night [23:58:54] I am pretty much always on irc :) but also usualy away [23:59:01] werdna: yes, how goes it ? [23:59:12] rmoen: apparently we have a date :) [23:59:42] werdna: yes :)