[00:01:05] ^demon: the F doesn't go where Brandon lives [00:01:05] just up to Castro / Market [00:01:26] i ended up cabbing it. [00:01:44] i had a major panic attack when i was on my SECOND train breakdown of the day. [00:01:52] <^demon> danese: I know, I was just joking because the F is so slow :) [00:01:55] you know. all "fuck this shit". [00:02:39] i may have some work for a mediawiki contractor. not a lot of work, but back-end mostly. [00:02:43] not me; a friend. [04:15:12] Who's notpeter? [05:30:54] Shirley: contractor for ops [05:31:01] doing sysadminny things [05:44:23] Oh, that's Youngmeister? [05:45:04] Noted. [15:52:58] would it make sense to have week or monthly posts with "who did what" type of things? [15:53:30] Nikerabbit, can you expand? [15:55:09] something like this: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/ThisWeekInKrita/~3/36KO17B2WFY/72-krita-in-march-2011 [15:56:34] Nikerabbit, well, for paid developers, we have the monthly reports. We're not really tracking the work of volunteer developers, but I'd love to include it. Do you have any ideas on how we could make this work? [15:57:31] Make someone read all commit summaries? :P [15:57:51] Or probably more easily, have a place where volunteer devs can note what they're doing if it's more of interest [15:57:57] I know signpost seem to follow commit logs [15:58:18] Maybe between the future volunteer dev coordinator and me we can make something work [15:59:13] Nikerabbit, if your interest in this is shared by other volunteers, I'd love to support it; but honestly I can't do it alone ) [15:59:56] Reedy: better to ask the developer themselves [16:00:20] I agree. [16:00:28] I don't know what others think, but I could provide few sentence reports every once in a while if asked [16:32:08] Hello sumanah. [16:32:32] sumanah, I'm preparing the next monthly engineering report, and I was wondering if you wanted to include specific information about GSoC. [16:32:34] hi guillom [16:32:40] guillom: I do. What's the deadline? [16:33:05] guillom: I am just now recovering from some illness -- today or tomorrow I was going to suggest I/we write a techblog entry encouraging GSoC submissions [16:33:09] <^demon> You have 5 seconds, gogogo! [16:33:15] NOOOOOOO [16:33:19] sumanah, March 30st, but earlier is better [16:33:30] guillom: phew! sure, I can do that [16:33:40] sumanah, sorry to hear that, I hope you recover soon. A techblog entry is a very good idea, and we can link to it in the report [16:33:43] guillom: thanks [16:34:01] sumanah, the current summary is at http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_engineering_report/2011/March#Upcoming_events ; also, tell me if you want me to review your blog post [16:34:02] guillom: it is at times like this that I am glad I work remotely, so you can't get sick from me, or hear my tubercular coughing [16:34:20] guillom: since I am fairly sure I do not have blog posting privs, I'd just send it to you anyway [16:34:27] sumanah, well, I work remotely too, so that makes me double safe ;) [16:34:31] :) [16:34:53] Anyway, just feel free to ping me if needed. [16:34:59] thanks guillom [16:35:19] np [16:36:07] the last eng report was probably the 1st & last time I'll ever be mentioned right next to Ward Cunningham [16:36:40] h??h?? [17:56:22] robla: well, the GSoC-related traffic in #mediawiki is picking up [17:56:40] If it picks up a bit more, can we move it out of the main channel please? [17:57:10] Reedy: you can always flee to here [17:57:22] Heh, it was more to help people wanting MW support etc [17:58:44] Nice to see the interest [17:58:46] <^demon> /flee alias /part [17:58:47] How many slots do we have? [17:58:48] <^demon> :) [17:59:09] We won't know till April, Reedy, but I suspect.... 6? [17:59:21] IIRC that's we had last year? [17:59:24] move it to what channel then? [17:59:29] <^demon> We had 5 or 6 last year, which means we actually will get 5 or 6 :) [17:59:36] yes it sure does [17:59:36] I seem to recall danese got us an extra [17:59:42] #mediawiki-gsoc [17:59:44] or something [17:59:48] meh [17:59:51] <^demon> Another channel? Nothanks. [17:59:52] yet another channel.... [17:59:56] hahaha [18:00:38] I was just suggesting if it starts getting *too* busy [18:00:49] <^demon> Move it here if it does :) [18:01:07] Hmm, that's probably saner [18:05:51] ny1 knows the meaning of this error: Fatal error: Call to undefined method Language::formatExpiry() in C:\wamp\www\Mediawiki\includes\Title.php on line 2161? [18:06:24] mayanks43, there is no method formatExpiry in the LanguageClass [18:06:55] This comes when try to go to the homepage of my wiki [18:07:13] Using what version of mw? [18:07:22] latest [18:07:33] from svn [18:07:34] latest doesn't help [18:07:36] Trunk? [18:07:39] yup [18:11:49] oh it seems my last svn update was broken [18:11:59] hah [18:12:00] never mind [18:46:43] DUDE. [18:48:56] WHERES MY CAR DUDE? [18:49:08] SWEET. [18:49:26] so, looks like all my beloved account creation stuff is gonna be a GSoC project. [18:49:37] *jorm cackles maniacly. [18:49:50] What acct create stuff exactly? [18:50:11] the ajaxification, the error stuff, the source tracking. [18:51:12] he's already pretty far along: http://akshayagarwal.in/mw/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page [18:52:49] Ah that guy [18:52:52] Cool [18:56:12] THEY CALL US FIERCE MARAUDERS, WARP RIDERS AND GUNS FOR HIRE, BEFORE THE SKY CRIED TEARS OF FIRE [18:56:12] Ohai neilk_ [18:56:32] RoanKattouw: Hey [18:56:40] So about UW [18:56:57] 1) do I need to just deploy trunk of UW next week? [18:57:06] (I see there's still some active development going on there) [18:57:11] Account creation cleanup is a good GSoC project. [18:57:17] 2) what's up with your stash-in-DB branch? [18:57:29] 3) any core changes that need to be pulled in for UW deployment? [18:57:43] Yeah. it's a five-step project, i think. [18:58:29] AJAXy things are nice but there are other "real" issues that could use cleaning up [18:59:14] RoanKattouw: Okay, I tried some client-side techniques to fix the race conditions we saw back in Nov. Those didn't work. So now I'm thinking I may want to deploy the stash-in-DB thing after all, but it's unfinished. If I don't finish that up today or tomorrow though, we won't develop further until after 3/31. [18:59:32] RoanKattouw: so, the answer to "do we need core changes" is ... maybe [18:59:40] OK [18:59:40] RoanKattouw: is that not enough lead time to review it [18:59:41] ? [19:00:05] Well it's not the end of the world if we don't pick that up on Tuesday, is it? [19:00:08] no [19:00:11] Ah, Wednesday [19:00:15] So let's just play that one by ear [19:00:18] RoanKattouw: real issues like which ones ? [19:00:18] then it's just upload 1 at a time [19:00:24] Monday is enough lead time if there's not much wrong with it [19:00:29] Roan: a big part of this is going to be moving the code into the API. Another part is going to be HTMLForm-ifying it. [19:00:33] If there are things wrong with it there may not be enough time [19:00:33] I'll try for getting that to you earlier. [19:00:39] Not much use [19:00:40] The ajax stuff is actually towards the bottom of the project list. [19:00:48] I'll barely be available starting about 2 hours from now [19:00:53] Cool [19:00:56] source tracking for account creation, too. [19:01:01] Btw, Roan and others, is there a guide like "so you want to add a table to MediaWiki" [19:01:03] mayanks43: Well some things could be made less confusing :) [19:01:12] neilk_: Not really [19:01:14] like blocking thing? [19:01:19] neilk_: "Have Roan do it." [19:01:25] It's called "pastebin it and show #mediawiki" [19:01:28] or show me [19:01:28] heh [19:01:39] well don't I need to make a patch file for update.php and fix tables.sql ? [19:01:57] i'm used to managing schema changes like that [19:02:10] Yes [19:02:19] Let me dig up one of my recent ones [19:02:29] I reverted it later but that's not the point :D [19:02:46] RoanKattouw: have I told you this week that you rock? [19:02:55] You have not. Thanks :P [19:03:05] That should be a bot response. [19:03:11] !rock roan [19:03:11] --elephant-- I don't know anything about "rock". [19:03:24] !rock is roan is like a rock [19:03:24] --elephant-- You don't have permission to do that. [19:03:27] Boo [19:03:34] !rock is `e1: You rock! [19:03:34] --elephant-- Successfully added keyword: rock [19:03:39] !rock RoanKattouw [19:03:39] --elephant-- RoanKattouw: You rock! [19:03:44] Whee [19:03:51] !r 83812 | neilk_ [19:03:51] --elephant-- neilk_: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Code/MediaWiki/83812 [19:04:01] neilk_: An obvious gap in that one is Postgres though :( [19:04:03] Ah [19:04:05] SQLite I mean [19:04:12] RoanKattouw: perfect, thanks [19:06:35] But SQLite should be self-explanatory, it can share the patch file and already shares tables.sql [19:06:52] Just be sure to write SQL code that's SQLite-compatible, but that's a general MW style guideline anyways [19:11:44] RoanKattouw: this is a table create, so it should be SQL-92. Don't anticipate any SQLite issue there. [19:11:56] Indexes [19:12:04] one or two indices [19:12:22] You have to put the CREATE INDEX statements outside the CREATE TABLE statement [19:12:29] yes of course [19:12:50] oh that's what you meant? Yeah but that's an issue with many dbs not just SQLite. [19:13:10] Well MySQL allows KEY( ) or INDEX( ) inside the creation statement [19:13:21] That's actually the canonical format (output by SHOW CREATE TABLE) [19:14:12] I'm looking it up, and that's definitely not in SQL-92 [19:14:28] I have no idea what SQL-92 is [19:14:30] jorm: I'm not sure why source tracking for account creation is important/useful/not creepy. Won't most sources just be random articles that people are looking at? [19:14:42] Pretending there is some kind of standard SQL is mostly silly [19:15:00] Shirley: Well they're hoping to see if their "You can create an account" calls to action have any effect I guess [19:15:02] You can't spell "Wikimedia" without "silly." [19:15:04] (In ArticleFeedback) [19:15:04] shirley: did the user create account through article feedback? liquid threads? the edit screen? [19:15:17] if so, do we have better long-term conversions with X, Y, or Z? [19:15:18] etc. [19:15:20] Ah, even more invasive. [19:15:31] But yeah, the distinction between edit screen, LQT, page read is also interesting [19:16:00] RoanKattouw: SQL-92 is the only standard in the SQL world, a very verbose but minimal standard for dbs to support. But usually vendors create a zillion shortcuts. [19:16:05] it'll be exceptionally useful to track if any calls-to-action are successful. [19:16:33] We wouldn't necessarily have to tie this to specific accounts, would we? [19:17:16] i think so. [19:17:23] we want to do long-term analysis. [19:17:36] 6 months is a good number. we can do roll ups after that, i'd expect. [19:17:40] Right. Long-term data storage of info like that usually prevents privacy policy problems. [19:17:48] Err, presents. [19:18:06] i don't see how, especially if we don't release it to the public. [19:18:09] What if we don't associate it with the user ID [19:18:16] But just increment stats counters [19:18:38] jorm: Well, you're essentially saying you want to track people over a long period of time. [19:18:53] Whether or not you do so publicly, it presents problems, I think. [19:18:53] *apergos gets anonymous [19:19:04] well, the point is to be able to find a cohort, say, jun 2011, and look at them in january 2012, and see who successfully became wikipedians. and then look and see how their first experiences went. [19:19:06] new ip for every edit. [19:19:10] hmm and every read [19:20:38] Have you seen ? [19:20:53] *apergos clicks [19:21:27] apergos: IPv6 FTW! [19:21:44] haha [19:21:52] I now remember where I remember duckduckgo from [19:21:55] Upon seeing the logo [19:22:06] :-D [19:22:13] There's a billboard for it by I-80 near the 3rd St/Stillman overpass [19:22:20] I saw a banner for it on ED. [19:22:36] what's up [19:22:46] http://duckduckgo.com/c/The_Simpsons_characters Heh. [19:23:02] probably only en pedia eh? [19:23:20] It's a generic search engine that heavily focuses on places such as Wikipedia. [19:24:11] It's funny that their billboard is like 100 yds from the old WMF office [21:27:12] sumanah, someone in #mediawiki is asking about GSOC [21:27:15] but you're not in there :P [21:27:41] Reedy: I just needed a break from the war stories [21:28:33] sorry about that. [21:30:11] So, are people still attracted to buzzwords like AJAX? :P [21:30:32] Reedy: they are. [21:30:46] Can we put something up about cloud, and nosql and stuff? [21:31:02] web 5.0 [21:31:23] "MediaWiki needs more synergy" [21:31:35] It will require some blue sky thinking to achieve this [21:31:36] that's a forward-looking statement [21:31:44] can we circle back to drill down? [21:33:45] We need to slice and dice the data [21:34:09] Reedy: careful, I have a master's in tech management, I can go on for a while like this [21:34:23] It's win-win, so ping me at the next probortunity with the metrics and we can disseminate the cross functionalities [21:34:35] I should stop procrastinating [21:35:20] "Let's throw some bodies in the genius-storming room to power-solve this bad boy until they're sweating like cheap hookers in suits" [21:35:22] that's bad [21:35:53] *Reedy stops procrastinating and goes to sort food [21:40:03] oh man that was a brain-damaging backread [21:40:13] *Krinkle still suspects Reedy works in a grocery store. Ananas, Banana, Citron, P [21:40:46] Krinkle, seriously, I'm really bad for procrastinating making food to eat [21:41:02] I can prove i'm not in grocery store if you want ;P [21:42:24] I'll take your word for it. [21:48:30] <^demon> sumanah: I've worked in local gov't and for a huge financial services company, I think I can give you a run for your money with silly mgmt quips :) [21:48:59] what monster did I create! [21:49:51] <^demon> The monster is due to scope creep, I'm afraid [21:50:10] <^demon> Failure to define objectives, lack of concrete deliverables. [21:54:01] <^demon> http://www.bnet.com/blog/salesmachine/the-8-stupidest-management-fads-of-all-time/12307 is a fun read :p [21:54:08] Meeting time!!111! [21:54:15] <^demon> And it starts with Six Sigma :D [21:54:32] Ah, no! Not the six sigmas! [21:54:37] You're going too far! [21:55:05] <^demon> Dumbest crap I heard of in my life. I actually heard people at Cap1 talking about their belt colors and stuff. I wanted to hit them with a steel pipe. [23:24:02] nimish_g: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/mediawiki/wiki/Berlin_Hackathon_2011 [23:24:19] https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/mediawiki/wiki/Berlin_Hackathon_2011#Topics [23:34:30] hey jorm, I want some of your girl scout cookies [23:34:50] i'm stealing some, because I lack courage, confidence, and character [23:35:09] i am supposed to share them, so go ahead. [23:35:15] they are a gift from rebecca. [23:35:33] awe [23:35:48] they are dark and yet refreshing, much like rebecca [23:35:59] YOU ARE STEALING WHAT HAS BEEN FREELY GIVEN. [23:36:03] as it were. [23:36:06] canhascookie? [23:36:24] and personally, i don't think you lack in any of those qualities. [23:36:53] It's true, it did take guts to go over the cubicle wall [23:37:10] a daring daylight heist as it were [23:37:19] you have at least 6 characters, neilk_ [23:37:22] we are desperately waiting to find out if we got the apartment we want. pins and needles over here. [23:37:42] jorm: good luck. praying to real estate gods [23:37:49] jorm: east bay? [23:38:36] yup. the beast. [23:38:47] ("east bay" is pig latin for "beast") [23:39:13] jorm: you buying ot renting? [23:39:17] or even [23:39:21] renting. [23:39:30] TimStarling: while you're here, and while pdhanda is here, should we take a quick look at the commit access queue? [23:39:33] the landlord asked for our credit reports yesterday. [23:39:47] ok [23:39:52] mine's "okay" (715 ish) but stacey's is crazy high (over 800) [23:40:09] *pdhanda brings up the queue [23:40:38] heh....just looked. I don't think there's anything new, so there's just the existing stuff. might be good to find a phone for this part [23:40:54] pdhanda: should we grab R5 and call Tim? [23:41:04] ok [23:41:07] on my way [23:43:20] <^demon|dinner> nom nom nom. [23:43:30] <^demon|dinner> Should I join in? [23:45:51] maybe you can call in from the conference room to one of the conference numbers? [23:46:24] <^demon|dinner> Are you guys on a conference line already? [23:46:30] I'm not [23:46:44] oh...hey ^demon. how about x2003? [23:46:48] we're in a conf room but not on phone yet yet [23:46:56] <^demon|dinner> x2003 it is. [23:51:40] http://bug-attachment.wikimedia.org/attachment.cgi?id=8239 [23:51:48] + global $wgJobExplitRequestTypes; [23:58:29] I'm losing my mind here, how can I get Apache to not use Content-Encoding: gzip -- as far as I can tell mod_deflate is not being invoked by config