[20:27:52] guillom: are you around? [20:28:07] I am [20:28:20] hi guillom [20:28:23] heya [20:28:24] guillom: cool [20:28:59] guillom, flipzagging: let's go thru where we are briefly [20:29:10] ok, as for me [20:29:21] so, today, working on completing and polishing the project report, and discussing with pete about the ford report [20:29:33] (an email should go through this afternoon) [20:29:47] (also, running out of paper tissues) [20:29:57] I guess the right word is facial tissues [20:30:06] both correct [20:30:09] guillom: could pete help? [20:30:33] alolita, with the facial tissues? No. But Pete's going to write the Ford report based on my master project report. [20:30:49] guillom: :-) no with the ford project report [20:31:07] I didn't know Pete was that involved with Ford [20:31:16] guillom: do you have a cold [20:31:39] Pete's going to work with Sara on Foundation grants & reporting for the next 3 months, and he has inherited the Ford report. [20:31:46] flipzagging: pete just joined sara's team this week i think [20:31:51] k [20:32:06] alolita, yep, I've been sneezing & coughing for a couple of days. [20:32:25] guillom: sorry to hear that - so i hope resting today helps [20:32:34] yeah, please rest [20:32:42] guillom: any news from michael [20:32:43] fever? that's what I had [20:32:46] well, I'm can work, so I work [20:32:49] no, no fever [20:33:15] and no news from Michael, but he said he'd get back to me by Friday, and contact me before if needed [20:33:32] also s/'m/ [20:33:39] guillom: ok cool [20:34:17] flipzagging: what's up on your end [20:34:20] flipzagging, didn't mean to interrupt you at the beginning, sorry. So how are you doing? [20:35:09] ok, on Monday we made UploadWizard use Roan & Trevor's resource-loader [20:35:34] flipzagging: are you still integrating with rl [20:35:41] unfortunately yes [20:35:48] :( [20:35:55] I don't know why I thought this would be easy [20:36:13] anyway it's just the language portion that doesn't work, which mdale needs to make work as well [20:36:18] so he's doing that as we speak [20:36:23] flipzagging: i didn't think it would be easy [20:36:36] me from several weeks ago was avoiding this too [20:36:45] clearly I lost some brain cells while I was sick [20:37:09] flipzagging: maybe we shouldn't integrate - do we have a choice? [20:37:15] anyway I have a few things I can attend to while mdale works on this. If it's not resolved in a few hours I might revert [20:37:31] we can just revert [20:37:33] flipzagging: have you had a chance to look at other components [20:37:38] ? [20:37:55] other components? [20:37:55] the other option that would be eaiser is to add the mediaWiki.messageParser as an extension .. its a little easier to integrate like that since it does not have to touch so many parts of core [20:38:13] ( for tests and registration ) [20:38:16] flipzagging: help subsystem, interface stuff etc. [20:38:42] alolita: oh yes, I can work on many other things, it's not a 100% blocker [20:38:57] alolita: anyway my *main* goal is to rejoin trunk [20:39:25] flipzagging: aah - do you need some of roan's time [20:39:29] alolita: so I've been making nips and tucks in preparation of that [20:39:33] alolita: not that I'm aware of [20:39:40] flipzagging: ok [20:39:54] I have core commit now, so I can do it whenever I feel like. I just want to verify a few more things [20:40:19] flipzagging: cool; are you doing a prototype drop also [20:40:34] hm, I didn't do one last Friday [20:40:43] I suppose I could but I might as well wait till this Friday [20:40:47] flipzagging: let's try to do one this friday [20:40:57] we can do more than try ;) [20:41:14] flipzagging: good :-) [20:41:24] anyway nobody has responded to my info-dump on wikitech-l, and so on [20:41:37] which is about what I expected (...planned ;) [20:41:49] flipzagging: is there a commons list that we should post that on also? [20:41:58] not developer-related [20:42:06] flipzagging: true [20:42:16] there is a commons-l, but it's more general, and it's all the same pple anyway. [20:42:26] from a dev perspective. [20:42:34] flipzagging: yes [20:42:34] very low traffic [20:43:09] flipzagging, guillom: let's touch base tomorrow then [20:43:10] anyway that's life on this side of the office. [20:43:16] ok [20:43:23] tomorrow then [20:43:50] flipzagging, guillom : thanks!!! and i am working on the launch info which i will be tapping flipzagging to review [20:43:58] re: wikitech-l: it can be a good thing if nobody complains [20:44:00] great! [20:44:21] it could also be that they don't care, but usually they'd complain anyway if there was something to complain about [20:44:22] flipzagging, guillom: ttyl then :-) [20:44:34] guillom: that post was carefully crafted to give the maximum information while eliciting the minimum response. [20:44:57] i.e. the usual trolls should be scared off [20:45:16] I don't believe there are trolls on wikitech-l. [20:45:20] i thought Tim was going to say something, though, I wrote a few flags to specifically attract his attention. [20:45:46] Yes, Tim should definitely comment. [20:46:15] If he doesn't despite you drawing his attention to it, then it's a good sign :) [20:46:19] right [20:46:28] flipzagging: tim may be traveling or just busy with other things such as a new baby [20:46:40] right [20:46:47] Right now he's probably packing while changing diapers :P [20:47:07] anyway, I'm not saying that I'm hostile to input, far from it [20:47:25] it's just that there's a way to do it that gives trolls an opening, and a way that doesn't [20:48:11] RoanKattouw: Hi! looking forward to meeting you at the Hack-A-Ton [20:48:28] Absolutely! [20:53:58] wait. you two haven't met? [20:55:07] jorm: :-) [21:00:18] RoanKattouw: how's it going? [21:00:40] Cadence is at work with me right now [21:00:48] hah [21:00:53] she's playing quietly with toys while I work... we're in R7 [21:00:57] Half-watching a movie, idling [21:01:04] Wait. Cadence? Quietly? [21:01:32] yeah, it's surprising, I know [21:01:51] we shall see how long that lats for [21:01:56] aww [21:01:59] urgh. someone went into my i18n file for tradetrack and changed the labels but didn't also go and change where the labels were used. [21:02:19] *RoanKattouw hands jorm an SVN blam [21:02:20] changed the label keys or values? [21:02:21] e [21:02:26] the keys. [21:02:31] jorm: wow [21:02:33] it was Raymond. [21:02:44] RoanKattouw: cadence says hi [21:02:53] :) [21:03:15] she thinks you live in "francansiso" [21:03:30] I explain you live in europe [21:03:59] new macbook air... wow, that looks thin [21:04:18] By Francansiso she does mean SF, right? [21:04:29] Maybe she's just seeing the future ;) [21:04:50] guh, hang on, I need to get my Macbook Air, there's something caught in my teeth [21:05:23] ha ha ha [21:05:29] i seem to remember reading some story where a guy had a macbook air and thinks he threw it away. [21:05:46] like, it ended up getting lost in a stack of papers and that was that. [21:05:57] haha [21:06:00] i think "bullshit" but the idea amuses me. [21:06:00] wow [21:06:08] wow, this thing is pretty much at the limit of thickness now. It's just barely thicker than a standard USB port. [21:06:51] no, they can still use mini and micro USB [21:07:34] or they could just declare everything has to use bluetooth [21:07:39] yes [21:11:10] hey, have any of you seen this before [21:11:14] google "macbook" [21:11:24] you get a live updating count of twitter and other mentions [21:11:49] I don't see it [21:11:51] Link? [21:12:02] (I don't see it on https://encrypted.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=macbook&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8 at least) [21:12:20] http://www.google.com/search?q=macbook [21:12:24] holy crap. [21:12:28] that's pretty cool. [21:12:48] Oh it's below a screenful of sponsored ads [21:13:02] That's pretty cool [21:13:07] click on the link. [21:13:27] Dude! [21:13:43] I'd seen something like that before, it was the updating count that was new I think [21:14:18] i'm not sure what i think about the new macbook. [21:15:25] new macbook? [21:15:34] I was totally asleep on te switch [21:15:36] the new macbook air thing. [21:15:36] *the [21:15:53] i mean, it's pretty and all. but it's kind of . . . low-end. [21:15:57] which i guess is to be expected. [21:16:26] I'm in the wrong language edition so I don't get the live twitter etc ( flipzagging ) [21:17:51] Seriously, though, a thousand bucks for a laptop? Not me [21:18:01] hmm [21:18:06] 1.4ghz [21:18:07] so, you're never going to buy a mac, huh? [21:18:07] bummer [21:18:20] RoanKattouw: what do you use? [21:18:34] the 3" is a bit better for processor [21:18:35] but still [21:18:38] RoanKattouw: thinking of getting a laptop for personal use, chances are non-Mac. [21:18:57] I'm thinking I wanna replace this laptop in 9-12 months [21:19:01] I'll be 3 years old by then [21:19:13] you'll be 3? [21:19:18] LOL [21:19:19] I always knew you were a yungun [21:19:21] but ... [21:19:25] :-P [21:19:30] I guess that was in metric years or something [21:19:34] :-D [21:20:03] If I were the one using a retarded measuring system, I wouldn't gloat about it. [21:20:17] If a metric year is a decade, that sounds about right [21:20:49] wikipedia has a 51K article on whether there should be one or two spaces following a sentence [21:20:50] guillom: Worst part is flipzagging doesn't even *use* that system, probably (being Canadian) [21:21:01] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentence_spacing [21:21:27] I regularly do some POV-pushing about thaton the office wiki. [21:24:58] i double space after sentences but it's a habit from my typing classes. [21:26:31] +1 (2 spaces after end of sentence) [21:26:49] the iphone assumes two spaces. [21:26:59] which is a weird convention. [21:27:08] double space at the end of a sentence and it will add the period for you. [21:27:09] You're all just a bunch of heretics. [21:27:18] you're just french. [21:27:29] *jorm ducks. [21:27:30] ga-zing! [21:27:31] :-D [21:27:34] Precisely. [21:27:49] That means I'm right, and you're not, unless you agree with me. [21:27:54] guillom, shouldn't you have said "Touche" ? [21:27:58] :-D [21:28:01] I'm also against double spacing,but the fact that I'm European as well doesn't help me [21:28:07] Reedy_, NEVAR. [21:28:18] Pft. [21:28:23] RE: Sentacne spacing - wow [21:28:40] there's actually a neat rhythm that comes up when you double space after the end of a sentence. [21:28:43] no. I'm not even going to click through. just no. [21:28:50] we should just write it into the software to enforce one way or the other, silently, and watch them all go crazy [21:28:55] see also: "List of Fictional Cats" [21:29:16] Special:Random [21:29:18] gogogogo [21:29:30] [[Wet t-shirt contest]] [21:29:32] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_cats [21:29:38] Reedy_: At least guillom would spell it right ;) [21:29:46] Touché. =) [21:29:50] RoanKattouw, pfft [21:30:01] only 1 fictional radio cat [21:30:03] really? [21:30:05] Very nice guillom [21:30:07] [[Boxing_at_the_1996_Summer_Olympics_–_Flyweight]] [21:30:18] For me to get the accented e, would require me looking up the alt + number code or similar for it :P [21:30:35] Whereas for me, it's on my keyboard. [21:30:41] ooh la laa [21:30:51] I should probably start packing [21:30:53] touch´; [21:31:00] hrm. [21:31:08] é [21:31:14] that's it. option-e, e [21:31:44] What about € ? [21:31:56] I've got it as an alternate on 4/$ [21:32:02] I've no idea how the feck you get it to do it thoug [21:32:03] h [21:32:19] 朜´å∂ß®†¥¨ˆˆøπ“åß∂ƒ©˙∆˚¬……æææ [21:32:26] *Reedy pats jorm on the head [21:32:26] I use a French keyboard mapping on my US laptop, which makes things easier. [21:32:30] jorm, i found some toffee crisps! [21:32:30] It's AltGr+5 for me [21:32:34] � [21:32:36] Ah [21:32:38] Ta roan [21:32:40] guillom: You have a VERY strange definition of "easy" [21:32:46] Z͏a͝lgo [21:32:59] *RoanKattouw glares at whoever thought AZERTY was a good idea [21:33:07] lol [21:33:47] i hope my dio shirt arrives before friday. [21:34:06] RoanKattouw, well, I bought a second-hand laptop ~6 years ago that had a German keyboard (QWERTZ), and I knew the French mapping (AZERTY) so transitioning to AZERTY on a US QWERTY keyboard is no big deal. [21:34:23] just never look at the keys :) [21:34:27] Ugh German mappings are annoying as well [21:34:42] I like the idea of those blank keyboards [21:35:58] the only annoying thing is that on a French keyboard, we have a key for < & > ; that key doesn't exist on US keyboards, so I can't access these two characters. Instead, I use the logo/windows key to switch to the US mapping, and I can insert the <>s [21:36:26] Anyway. [21:36:29] Project report. [21:36:38] Yeah well the French like their quotation marks to be different [21:36:52] No, the quotation marks are « and » :) [21:37:23] You mean angle brackets? [21:37:32] <<>> [21:37:36] < and > are on the US-International 104-key layout, right? [21:37:46] you don't have > and < ? [21:37:52] If they weren't, programming would be hell [21:38:19] RoanKattouw, they are, but you have to use Shift on , and . [21:38:30] Our keyboards do that [21:38:33] Yeah, so [21:38:41] you have to do that on US keyboards, too. [21:38:50] I'm talking about US keyboards [21:38:54] maybe I'm not clear [21:39:03] Oh wait [21:39:05] ˘˘˘˘˘¯¯¯¯˘˘˘˘ [21:39:06] I understand now [21:39:12] The French layout does *not* have < and > [21:39:20] on a French keyboard, we have a key for < and shift-ing it gives >. [21:39:41] Right [21:39:52] So they're there but just in a different place [21:39:56] Since I use a US keyboard with a French mapping, and that dedicated key doesn't exist on a US keyboard, I can't enter them via the French mapping. [21:40:02] Oh [21:40:08] It's a dedicated key, rigth [22:00:11] [16:30:49] (also, running out of paper tissues) [22:00:12] Heh. [22:01:43] flipzagging: It's fine to call people trolls, but realize that it's then you who is to blame for lowering the quality of the conversation. [22:01:52] And it makes it more likely for others to call you much worse. :-) [22:02:10] I'm running out of paper tissues here too. [22:02:50] fapfapfap [22:07:03] in any case, I haven't called anyone a troll. [22:07:18] I just said I'm going to post in ways that are less easy for trolls to subvert, to have their fun. [22:07:52] you should be happy that I'm making wikitech-l a place where trolls are less able to subvert discussion. [22:07:53] aren't you? [22:12:29] I like smart posting. [23:44:10] mdale: ok, so I'm working on the raw file in debug thing [23:45:17] there's a new optional parameter for ResourceLoaderFileModule::__construct that would indicate that a module should or should not link to raw files in debug mode, with should being the default [23:45:54] mdale isn't at his desk [23:46:09] oh wait, he's just returning from a meeting [23:47:10] TrevorParscal: sounds good [23:47:22] we really have to take out the array prototype extends functions [23:47:26] it's the debugRaw option [23:47:38] hey, so we were wondering what the reason for the Array.prototype extension really is [23:47:46] ran into a weird bug on JSON response with jQuery [23:47:48] it turns out this trips up jQuery [23:47:57] well, go ahead and swap out uses of indexOf with jQuery.inArray() if you could [23:48:04] and the .compare [23:48:12] could be done similarly [23:48:19] hey alolita [23:48:21] I think that's only being used in loader [23:48:39] we could just move it to be a local function in mediaWiki.loader [23:50:00] yea or make it a jquery function your choice ;) [23:50:11] for the indexOf we should use the jQuery helper [23:50:24] jQuery.inArray() [23:50:41] opps reading up ;) [23:51:00] oky almost have a "patch" ready ;) [23:57:03] TrevorParscal: do you have a preference of jQuery extend or local method? [23:57:10] for the "compare" function [23:57:16] local [23:57:19] oky [23:57:42] if jquery adds it in 1.5 we can just switch to using it [23:57:45] mediaWiki.util.compare [23:58:18] no, just add it as function compare() { .. } - like right after recurse or execute in the loader code [23:58:25] I don't want to bloat the API [23:58:32] oky [23:58:36] then we will be on the hook for more things to stay the same [23:58:51] I expect this will get implemented in jQuery at some point [23:59:01] maybe I will add a jQuery bug for it [23:59:10] sounds good [23:59:15] jQuery.compareArrays or something