[00:42:21] <werdna_>	greetings.
[00:49:53] <jorm>	howdy.  been crawling through bugs,
[01:06:34] <werdna>	jorm: yeah, thanks for that
[01:06:48] <jorm>	there are lots of them. it's slow going.
[01:06:56] <jorm>	but i'm taking a lot of them that fall into "design".
[01:07:18] <werdna>	yeah, I saw
[02:03:11] <Reedy>	jorm, about?
[02:05:08] <jorm>	si.
[02:05:29] <Reedy>	quick pm
[02:05:38] <jorm>	sure.
[02:47:02] *Ashlee 	gives jorm a hug.
[02:47:35] <jorm>	what was that for?
[02:48:00] <jorm>	also, dude: i'm not dissembling who suggested what because i'm trying to hide anything. i'm doing it to avoid people trolling them.
[02:48:28] <jorm>	the thanks button was a STRONGLY requested feature from many people.  but they wanted a "like" button and i felt that the semantics of that had been co-opted by facebook.
[02:48:59] <Ashlee>	A "like" button might have legitimacy.
[02:49:09] <Ashlee>	Nobody goes around on a wiki saying "thanks."
[02:49:11] <Ashlee>	It just isn't done.
[02:49:16] <jorm>	"like" has a very specific meaning and we wanted something more flexible.  at the same time, we wanted something that evoked a "positive" feeling, since a large part of the focus of LQT is the "Community Health" thing.
[02:49:26] <jorm>	except for barnstars, or cookies, or even sunflowers.
[02:49:45] <Ashlee>	Right.
[02:49:48] <Ashlee>	But those aren't replies.
[02:50:09] <jorm>	clicking the "thanks" button isn't a reply, either.
[02:50:22] <Ashlee>	I don't actually know your background, but are you familiar with Wikimedia (MediaWiki) feature bastardization?
[02:50:35] <jorm>	okay.  i'm totally happy to talk more about this with you - because i think that i can convince you that it's a good idea - but my lady is demanding that we walk out the door.
[02:50:45] <Ashlee>	Oh, go!
[02:50:48] <Ashlee>	I'll be here. :-)
[02:51:01] <jorm>	i am pretty easy to find out about.  i'm on facebook as jormosaurusrex; twitter as jorm; my domain is www.gaijin.com
[02:51:58] <Ashlee>	Our interpersonal connection would suffer if I just stalked you.
[02:52:09] <Ashlee>	Or something.
[02:52:21] <jorm>	i have been stalked by the goons at somethingawful.com.  i can handle it.
[02:54:52] <Ashlee>	When you return, we can discuss the evilness of the LATER resolution in Bugzilla.
[02:55:16] <Ashlee>	Though I may wait until tomorrow to talk to you about this, because it's certainly not office hours currently!
[05:10:14] <flipzagging>	well that was interesting
[05:10:44] <flipzagging>	just got off the phone with MS Research who want to contribute an extension
[05:11:36] <flipzagging>	never thought I'd be taking a call from an MS employee who wanted to learn how to contribute to a GPL project
[17:26:40] <TrevorParscal>	hi people
[17:27:44] <Ryan_Lane>	howdy howdy
[17:34:37] <jorm>	wow. that site is MESSED UP, ryan.
[17:34:53] <jorm>	it looks like debug is turned on and it's breaking everything.
[17:35:10] <Ryan_Lane>	lol
[17:35:20] <Ryan_Lane>	it wasn't me :)
[17:37:05] <TrevorParscal>	RoanKattouw_away: ... You alive?
[17:47:57] <jorm>	so glad i don't have to deal with people like this anymore: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/103367-Zynga-Seems-More-Sinister-Than-You-Might-Expect
[17:49:53] <RoanKattouw>	TrevorParscal: BAck
[17:49:59] <TrevorParscal>	hi
[17:50:13] <TrevorParscal>	I'm working on ResourceLoader - what are you doing?
[17:52:56] <RoanKattouw>	Just finished dinner, now at my dad's for the weekend
[17:53:14] <RoanKattouw>	Gonna sift through my wikibugs and mw-cvs backlog, over 2k messages
[17:53:26] <RoanKattouw>	If you need me to do something that's fine too
[17:54:19] <jorm>	something broke on the article assessment prototype site but i don't know what.
[17:55:26] <TrevorParscal>	RoanKattouw: I might ask for your help on some stuff - but for now, you're all good
[17:55:34] <RoanKattouw>	OK
[17:55:38] <RoanKattouw>	Will also submit my invoice
[17:55:43] <RoanKattouw>	jorm: I'll look at that real quick
[17:56:33] <jorm>	that would be great!
[17:56:46] *RoanKattouw 	yells "run update.php" at whoever updated that wiki
[17:56:53] *RoanKattouw 	proceeds to run update.php himself
[18:00:59] <RoanKattouw>	jorm: Fixed with a simple php maintenance/update.php
[18:25:31] <jorm>	thanks, man!
[19:37:16] <TrevorParscal>	OK, this should go in the MediaWiki hall of shame -> http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/includes/Skin.php?view=markup#l749
[19:40:28] <RoanKattouw>	Oh God
[20:08:07] <TrevorParscal>	RoanKattouw: what should we do about entrire style-sheets that should not be flipped?
[20:08:25] <RoanKattouw>	You implemented shouldFlip(), right?
[20:08:34] <TrevorParscal>	that's per module
[20:08:36] <RoanKattouw>	Or do you want this on the stylesheet level as opposed to the module level now?
[20:08:38] <RoanKattouw>	Right
[20:09:02] <TrevorParscal>	I'm looking at common.css and common_rtl.css
[20:09:03] <RoanKattouw>	It's trivial to hack support for /* @noflipfile */ into CSSJanus.php
[20:09:16] <RoanKattouw>	They should be merged, ideally (later)
[20:09:20] <TrevorParscal>	yes
[20:09:44] <TrevorParscal>	so, yeah, having a noflip for the whole file would be great
[20:10:41] <TrevorParscal>	seems like the common_rtl.css sheet can just die
[20:11:18] <TrevorParscal>	it's not even used by monobook
[20:11:23] <RoanKattouw>	lol
[20:11:25] <TrevorParscal>	hmm
[20:11:32] <RoanKattouw>	Is it even used anywhere?
[20:11:37] <TrevorParscal>	old old skins
[20:11:40] <TrevorParscal>	I'm going to leave it alone
[20:11:49] <TrevorParscal>	add a comment to it that is should die with the old skins
[20:11:52] <TrevorParscal>	in fire
[20:18:02] <TrevorParscal>	ok, ResourceLoaderSiteModule has CSS support
[20:18:47] <RoanKattouw>	Nice
[21:14:22] <jorm>	ah, crap.  all my friends who went to burning man have sobered up and are now writing blog posts about it.
[21:53:00] <TrevorParscal>	RoanKattouw: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=25124
[21:53:07] <TrevorParscal>	What are your thoughts
[21:53:08] <TrevorParscal>	?
[21:53:35] <RoanKattouw>	It has skins hardcoded where exactly?
[21:53:43] <TrevorParscal>	Resources.php
[21:53:58] <RoanKattouw>	Oh
[21:54:02] <RoanKattouw>	Sigh
[21:54:07] <RoanKattouw>	I'm not sure $wgStyleDirectory even works
[21:54:08] <TrevorParscal>	stuff in resources is all hardcoded too
[21:54:15] <RoanKattouw>	Nor that it's a desirable 'feature'
[21:54:20] <TrevorParscal>	right
[21:54:28] <RoanKattouw>	I say $wgStyleDirectory burns in hell
[21:54:36] <TrevorParscal>	I will see what's using it
[21:55:07] <TrevorParscal>	bawolff: we're talking about https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=25124
[21:55:15] <TrevorParscal>	which was reported by you
[21:55:33] <TrevorParscal>	we're leaning towards removing $wgStyleDirectory
[21:55:42] <bawolff>	It was actually a user whining about it on #mediawiki that caused me to report it
[21:55:53] <RoanKattouw>	Right
[21:56:38] <RoanKattouw>	Hm on second thought, I do see the argument
[21:56:38] <TrevorParscal>	it's used a few places, but it seems like it's not being used in many others
[21:56:44] <RoanKattouw>	$wgStylePath used to be honored
[21:56:48] <RoanKattouw>	And RL kills that too
[21:57:02] <RoanKattouw>	By pulling all JS+CSS from skins/ unconditionally
[21:57:22] <bawolff>	personally it seems like a recipe for bugs, since I can't imagine too many people use weird file layouts to test it
[21:57:41] <RoanKattouw>	Yeah the reason $wgStylePath exists is so people can customize it to fit their URL schema\
[21:57:51] <RoanKattouw>	FS access usually isn't the problem
[21:58:32] <RoanKattouw>	My "verdict": let's keep it the way it is now and burn any vars that make skins/ configurable because that makes just about as much sense as making includes/db/ configurable
[21:58:37] <RoanKattouw>	Now I need sleep
[21:59:03] <jorm>	lies
[22:00:27] <TrevorParscal>	hmm
[22:00:33] <TrevorParscal>	OutputPage still uses $wgStylePath
[22:00:50] <TrevorParscal>	which goes to skins/ right by default of course
[22:01:24] <TrevorParscal>	brb