[12:34:33] Does anyone know if there's a list somewhere of all the projects included in the RecentChanges EventStream? [12:35:42] samwalton9, I would assume it includes all public, in-cluster wikis? [12:36:13] Does that include outreach.wikimedia.org, do you know? [12:36:54] alex@alex-laptop:~/Development/Wikimedia/Operations-MediaWiki-Config (master)$ grep outreachwiki dblists/all.dblist [12:36:55] outreachwiki [12:36:55] alex@alex-laptop:~/Development/Wikimedia/Operations-MediaWiki-Config (master)$ grep outreachwiki dblists/private.dblist [12:36:55] alex@alex-laptop:~/Development/Wikimedia/Operations-MediaWiki-Config (master)$ [12:36:57] yes [12:37:06] Awesome, thanks :) [12:37:21] can just make an edit there and find out [12:38:05] Yeah I was going to do that but wondered if there might be a comprehensive list somewhere, rather than me having to go around making edits to check :D [12:38:40] Services like this don't generally get to keep their own lists of allowed wikis. It should be criteria based and the rules should be in MediaWiki. [12:38:58] (MediaWiki config) [13:38:24] quick edge case question: if someone has my password but fails on 2FA, will it be logged as successful or failed login? [13:39:35] I'd hope failed... But I can't guarantee [13:39:59] (not looked at the code) [13:40:11] Hopefully nobody has your password, revi :P [13:40:44] obviously haha [13:41:11] I usually don't care about my password, I let password manager do the job [13:41:32] Is it hypothetical? Or do you need me to look at the logs? [13:41:38] hypothetical [13:42:00] I am in front of public PC and was logging to WP with my alt, and wondered that [13:54:40] supposing they don't even provide the 2nd factor, it will probably be an incomplete login [14:00:09] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 60 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @subbu & @tgr - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [14:50:10] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 10 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @subbu & @tgr - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [15:01:34] Hello! Welcome to the Technical Advice IRC meeting. tgr and I are happy to help answer your questions. [15:01:47] Hi all! [15:02:31] Please ask you questions! Every topic is OK, the worst that can happen is that we don't know the answer. [15:03:10] Besides English, I can also answer queries in Hindi & Kannada. [15:03:14] This time you can also ask in Hungarian / ez alkalommal magyarul is kérdezhettek! [15:03:32] o/ [15:07:00] Question with regards to https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T113346 – I was looking yesterday around the code and couldn’t find any API that would provide customisation for first heading on special pages. Have I missed anything or is this not possible (in that task, we need to provide a parameter into default heading)? [15:08:40] Looking at the ticket now. [15:09:07] stjn: you need to override SpecialPage::getDescription() [15:09:52] note that that changes both the title and the page name as seen on places like Special:SpecialPages [15:14:09] the exact control flow is SpecialPage::execute calling setHeaders which calls $outputPage->setPageTitle( $this->getDescription() ) [15:14:46] Thank you very much for this. Not a straightforward name :-) [15:34:30] <[1997kB]> hi.. the new preferences is buggy.. [15:34:37] o/ [15:34:53] [1997kB]: What is buggy about it please? :) [15:35:16] Could you share with us [15:36:11] <[1997kB]> when I open, it shows all the tabs in one tab for the moment and then after scroll it fixes automatically [15:36:41] hmm... I've not had this behavior [15:37:43] [1997kB]: Could it have been an issue with internet lag? Not quite sure but I've not had that experience [15:37:59] <[1997kB]> i am getting this every time when I open at first, but when I switches between tabs it's fine.. [15:38:08] [1997kB]: Maybe you could emmmm file a task about it and screen shot the behavior you get (if possible)? [15:38:19] <[1997kB]> no.. is that because i am on mobile? [15:38:21] is it a flash of unstyled content" issue? i.e. the CSS takes a little bit to apply? [15:38:35] or, does it not apply at all till you scroll or click on a tab? [15:38:46] Mobile, let me try that now [15:39:44] [1997kB]: can you file a Phabricator ticket about it? [15:40:02] ideally, with a video or animated gif showing what's happening [15:40:05] * d3r1ck agrees with tgr [15:40:11] <[1997kB]> i can.. [15:40:15] and information about your browser and your connection [15:40:35] <[1997kB]> what info about connection? [15:41:07] what is your connection type, what is your connection speed [15:41:48] if you want to go all out you could attach a HAR recording of your browser traffic, after cleaning private data, but that's a bit of an effort [15:41:48] <[1997kB]> alright.. thanks you everyone. [15:42:09] <[1997kB]> HAR recording? [15:42:42] most browsers these days have a "save as HAR" option in their developer panels [15:43:11] it contains basically the same information you'd see in the network tab of the developer pannel [15:43:22] <[1997kB]> i don't think Opera mini for mobile have this.. [15:43:28] what requests the browser sent, what responses it received, cookies, exact timing [15:43:38] oh, you are using Opera Mini? [15:43:45] <[1997kB]> yes.. [15:44:00] yeah, probably not possible then [15:44:20] just test your connection speed and mention it so someone can try to reproduce [15:44:41] <[1997kB]> does Chrome have HAR recording? [15:44:45] Did a patch based on tgr's help here: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/464170 Theoretically should do the job. [15:45:47] Chrome does, yeah: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whNW8mzHCbo [15:46:06] but then behavior in Chrome and Opera Mini might be very different [15:46:16] especially if you use Opera's proxy feature [15:46:19] <[1997kB]> the mobile one?. [15:47:17] hm, not sure. Opera uses Chrome's rendering engine these days I think? [15:47:36] anyway probably best not to very about HARs unless asked on the ticket [15:47:44] <[1997kB]> alright.. [15:47:58] maybe the developers do not need it at all to understand what's happening [15:48:25] stjn, you seem to have a typo there: "inContentLnaguage" [15:48:47] jenkins will probably tell you anyway :) [15:49:23] or not .. [15:50:54] Oh. Thanks :-D [16:00:21] tgr looks like we are done for this round? [16:00:45] yeah. Thanks everyone for participating! [16:01:52] there will be another Tech Advice Hour later today, in a timezone that's nicer for those in the Americas (23:00 UTC) [16:02:31] thanks! [16:02:34] and of course this is a support channel so feel free to ask questions outside meeting hours as well, it just might take longer to get an answer [17:13:59] <[1997kB]> hey I'M receiving- Exception: No configured storage engine can store this file. See "Configuring File Storage" in the documentation for information on configuring storage engines. when uploading video to phab. [17:14:18] how big is it? [17:14:25] <[1997kB]> 10mb [17:14:36] i think thats bigger then the max limit we have set [17:15:08] <[1997kB]> what's the max? [17:15:28] i think 8mb [17:16:02] you can always upload it to Commons or some random internet storage service like Dropbox or Google Drive [17:18:58] Hello, can you tell me where I can find the source for the VisualEditor? [17:21:36] Der_Keks, the core or the bit that integrates with ME? [17:23:29] MW* [17:24:12] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:VisualEditor#Download [17:31:19] <[1997kB]> tgr: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T206143 [17:32:38] thanks [1997kB] [17:34:22] huh, that looks pretty bad [17:34:35] do you know what connection speed you have? [17:35:11] <[1997kB]> ~5mbps [17:35:41] I can confirm that bug. [17:36:35] can't be a speed issue then, the whole page is around 200K [17:36:51] andre__: also on Opera Mini? [17:37:05] thanks MatmaRex [17:37:11] <[1997kB]> also it happens on Chome for Android. [17:37:24] tgr: Firefox on Fedora [18:26:16] I want to understand the technical background of Babel on meta. User:AKlapper_(WMF) has the following code on his userpage (meta): "{{babel-plain|Phabricator}}". I get the Phabricator-block in german and want to understand why. The second thing is that I cannot find the Phabricator-block on meta. In the de.wiki... for example I can access the code of the Babel-block "User_de" with calling https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vorlage:U [18:26:16] ser_de. Can someone clearify me up? [18:42:06] Der_Keks: the babel is provided by a MediaWiki extension [18:42:33] so it's not like in my "well known" de wiki? [18:42:35] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Babel [18:42:41] ? [18:43:22] ah [18:43:28] this seems like a hack [18:43:34] ? [18:43:46] phabricator is not strictly a language people would speak [18:44:24] yeah but the block can detect which clanguage i've chosen [18:44:25] although if someone really masters phabricator, he is probably AKlapper [18:44:37] ok i'll ask him directly :) [18:44:52] I'm looking [18:45:00] oh ok thx [18:45:10] as for the language you see it in, that's because you have the interface in German [18:45:28] the phabricator text is probably on a MediaWiki: message [18:45:56] can you tell me how to get the link to the phabricator-block? [18:46:33] on the dewiki it's https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vorlage:**NameOfBabelBlock** (Template) [18:46:54] or with a ":" at the beginning in another namespace like user: [18:47:59] so if i want to get the english-2 block i need to call https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vorlage:User_en-2 [18:48:25] this logic does not work on meta [18:48:58] the template you want is https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:User_Phabricator [18:50:24] ah ok. The reference in the source on aklapper's userpage is just "phabricator". Is it always with "User_*"? [18:50:50] first of all [18:50:55] on meta: it uses Babel extension [18:51:05] while on dewiki you seem to be using a template-based version [18:51:11] and that's not the same like in the wikis? [18:51:13] ok [18:51:28] thank you nice to know [18:51:38] or maybe it's just that for en-2 there's a customized version... :P [18:51:41] as for the name [18:51:57] you helped me very much thank youi [18:51:58] it is given by the contents of [[MediaWiki:Babel-template]] [18:52:00] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Babel-template [18:52:21] which will be almost always Template:user_* [18:52:24] ah I see [18:52:29] as that's the default [18:52:50] but on dewiki you could have changed it to eg. Vorlage:Benutzer_$1 [18:53:09] puh that cleared the mystic fog :) [18:55:39] :) [18:58:35] that explains why the block from dewiki ":de:User:Torana/Vorlage:NazisRaus" could not be imported: the extension does "Template:User :de:User:Torana/Vorlage:NazisRaus" [20:15:02] Hi, is there any "working" gerrit test instance? I found gerrit-test.wmflabs.org and gerrit-new.wmflabs.org, both do not accept ssh connections on the gerrit's port. Thanks! [20:17:10] Urbanecm hi, there's https://gerrit.git.wmflabs.org/r/ [20:17:25] thank you paladox, looking [20:18:06] silly question, how can I create credentials? Pressing sign up directs me to wikitech and my wikitech creds do not work [20:18:09] paladox, ^^ [20:18:25] Urbanecm you sign up at http://ldapauth-gitldap.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page [20:18:32] *https://ldapauth-gitldap.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page [20:19:24] account from https://ldapauth-gitldap.wmflabs.org/wiki/Main_Page doesn't work either [20:19:42] Urbanecm https://ldapauth-gitldap.wmflabs.org/w/index.php?title=Special:CreateAccount&returnto=Main+Page [20:19:57] you then use the username and password to login into https://gerrit.git.wmflabs.org/r/ [20:20:11] I just created account there, but the username and password do not work on gerrit.git.wmflabs.org [20:20:18] It's called UrbanecmTest [20:20:24] hmm [20:21:36] Urbanecm try now [20:21:56] oh [20:21:59] found it [20:21:59] still Authentication failed. [20:22:15] Urbanecm try now [20:22:39] I'm in, thanks! [20:23:06] BTW, do you know if there are any plans on how to the new UI of gerrit working on prod gerrit by default? [20:23:29] Urbanecm yep, as soon as we update to 2.16 it will be made the default [20:23:35] as upstream have made it the default [20:23:53] with the old ui now being offically deprecated and will be removed in the next release [20:24:08] Ok, thanks Are there some time estimates on when our gerrit will be updated to 2.16? [20:24:23] Nope, 2.16 has not be branched yet. [20:24:37] ok, thank you! [20:24:44] some users have called for it to be branched so it can be released at there next hackathon next month. [20:24:59] you mean, gerrit's hackathon? [20:25:04] yep [20:25:13] https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/repo-discuss/uVQbBOC9IeU [20:25:40] Ok, thank you. BTW, can you make the button sign up on gerrit.git.wmflabs.org to point to ldapauth-gitldap.wmflabs.org? [20:26:02] i could but that would require me to create a custom patch on the puppet master [20:26:40] would that be a problem? [20:27:53] Not really [20:28:29] Hmm. I tried to add my SSH key to test gerrit. I got "Server error: Internal server error" :( [20:29:09] done [20:29:12] hmm [20:29:14] * paladox looks [20:29:47] oh [20:29:54] it's using some old mail soy files [20:30:09] I don't know what is "may soy file" :( [20:31:05] Urbanecm try now [20:31:15] Urbanecm it's files in the backend that generate the emails you get [20:31:44] It says "Gerrit is down. We're working on bringing it back as soon as possible. [20:31:44] Please follow along the discussion at #wikimedia-operations on freenode as we debug." now [20:33:29] hmm [20:34:28] Urbanecm try now [20:35:01] works, thank you! [20:35:29] your welcome :) [21:49:19] @seen bawolf [21:49:19] ankry: I have never seen bawolf [21:50:54] @seen bawolff [21:50:54] Niharika: Last time I saw bawolff they were quitting the network with reason: Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 52.9.0/20180621064021] N/A at 10/3/2018 12:17:11 AM (21h33m42s ago) [22:00:17] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 60 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @bawolff - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [22:50:20] Technical Advice IRC meeting starting in 10 minutes in channel #wikimedia-tech, hosts: @bawolff - all questions welcome, more infos: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Technical_Advice_IRC_Meeting [22:50:41] \o bawolff just to let you know im around :) [22:50:49] What happened to my co-hosts? ;) [22:51:47] Oh I guess its just us to, I thought there was a third signed up [22:51:50] *two [22:52:34] Anyways, exciting times [22:53:12] Also, I guess this meeting is likely to attract unregistered users, any chance I can be an op for the duration of the meeting (/me looks at Isarra ) [22:54:26] ugh. +r here is going to block unregistered users completely right? [22:55:14] I think they are just invisible to non-ops [22:55:26] and then ops can voice them once they have realized they are not spam [22:55:32] *POWER* [22:55:36] Thank you [22:56:16] bawolff: I just tried via webchat.freenonde.net and got kicked directly into #wikimedia-overflow [22:56:24] oh, :( [22:56:45] Can it just be turned off for the time being? [22:57:12] I think that's best [22:57:28] We could turn it back on in an hour [22:57:51] I think its worth trying personally, but do not have the ULTIMATE POWER!!! needed to do so [22:58:10] Do i now that I'm an op [22:58:16] * bawolff doesn't know how irc works [22:58:35] Is that right? [22:58:44] yep [22:58:54] yeah. let me try again with the web gateway [23:00:11] * bd_test waves to other self. Hi bd808 [23:01:54] haha [23:02:11] just to check.. there's no real life hangout for this, right? Just IRC? [23:02:31] * bd808 looks around for people to bug bawolff and jdlrobson with good questions [23:02:56] I'm in the library today, so hangout doesn't really work for me [23:03:04] jdlrobson: yeah, irc only although you and bawolff may want a backchannel of some sort if multiple people show up [23:03:17] fine with me :) [23:05:12] Every question is helpful :) [23:06:02] I mostly work with the mobile parts of MediaWiki - MobileFrontend, Minerva and the frontend parts of mediawiki-core (for better or worse!) so have lots of expertise in those areas if you are curious about anything, unsure about something, want to help with something in those areas [23:06:30] jdlrobson: while waiting for more interesting questions... are you working on an projects right now that you'd like to tell us about? I know you have done some interesting things with notifications and feeds in the past [23:07:56] does the mobil site play nicely with notches? [23:09:19] geniice: do you mean phones that have a speaker/mic that poke down into the display field? [23:09:48] I think so? I'm still using a flip phone [23:10:54] we've not done anything specific in that area so i doubt it does [23:11:08] * bawolff is trying to google image search this [23:11:29] I think that would be handled by the web browser on the device. The iPhone X is one phone that I know got some press for its "notch" -- https://www.cnet.com/pictures/phones-with-notches/ [23:11:29] can you educate me ? Are there any sites that make use of this well? Is there any use cases you have in mind? [23:11:57] ah interesting [23:12:12] im an Android user so I can't say i've looked into this [23:12:15] jdlrobson the iPhone version will play videos in a manner that overlays the notch. You also lose anything else at the top of the broser if the phone is held upright [23:12:32] So the screen area is not a rectangle? That seems kind of silly [23:12:45] Technology man, I'll never understand [23:12:52] anroid uses the space for status stuff and just blacks out the screen for videos leaving a rectangle [23:13:52] The mobile site does have a web manifest (https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Manifest) which is in w3c draft (https://w3c.github.io/manifest/) [23:14:13] some changes were just pushed to tweak the android status bar display [23:14:28] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T204691 [23:14:46] I'm curious now how things look in iOS X with the notch :) [23:15:06] * jdlrobson boots up browser stack [23:15:28] does the WMF have test divices? [23:15:46] so it looks like the notch is not part of the browser, so we do play well [23:16:12] we do. We have a cabinet with some physical devices in the office and since lots of us are remote there's other test devices around the world [23:16:39] https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/qle6h97o/1538608594.JPG [23:16:40] when distributing remotely we generally encourage different people to have different phones [23:17:00] https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/ZHAZ7XCS/Screen%20Shot%202018-10-03%20at%204.16.46%20PM.png [23:17:02] (From a real device in my hands.) [23:17:09] James_F: helpful :) [23:17:11] so who gets lumbered with the wierd chinese things? [23:17:19] geniice: also using browserstack for testing [23:17:34] There's some interesting old devices on the office wiki page about it [23:17:36] browser stack has good coverage for ios and android [23:18:22] Unless you want to test very old stuff. Testing the oojs library in Safari 5 (with which we have nominal compatibility) isn't possible, for instance. [23:18:27] Like old phones that don't support html [23:18:48] most obscure device i have available is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_Asha_501 :) [23:19:42] generally we test for where the traffic is https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Compatibility#Browser_support_matrix [23:20:05] UC browser and Opera Mini are interesting to us [23:20:10] as we see lots of mobile traffic on those browsers [23:20:40] the former is luckily quite a decent browser. The latter has lots of issues (and we have a contact in Opera we generally ping about those issues). [23:20:52] jdlrobson: I could look in my closet for crappy old phones to donate to you. I think I still have a couple generations of blackberry devices from around 2006 and may have a first gen palm pilot [23:22:05] It would be really cool if wikimedia could provide a device lab in SF :) https://www.devicelab.org/ [23:22:15] bd808: i think the office gladly accepts donations :) [23:22:48] In terms of current projects mobile team is looking at: [23:23:13] We are working on better editing tools https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Reading/Web/Advanced_mobile_contributions Several things on the go right now relating to that. [23:23:15] One I'm interested in is that the mobile site has some sub-par mobile-only special pages that replace desktop pages (e.g. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Jdlrobson + https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Watchlist, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:History/Spain ). I'm interested in making some changes in core's code to support removing those. [23:23:28] * pdf rendering via a chromium based service (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T181084) [23:23:55] counting client side errors to hopefully make a case for having Sentry in production (https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T205582) [23:24:29] has anyone looked into uploading mobile generated 3d scans? [23:24:29] and modernising the tooling for building the complicated JavaScript the mobile site has (using webpack) [23:24:38] not 3d scans no [23:24:44] but we used to provide photo uploading via mobile [23:24:48] but that didn't go so well.. [23:25:21] hmm, tbf, the selfie-apocolypse seems much less likely with 3d scans than photos [23:25:44] trying to find a link... [23:26:10] bawolff: the issue is if you provide the ability to upload 3d photos [23:26:20] you are also providing the ability to upload selfies :) [23:26:42] The challenge is making uploading photos via web easy but not too easy that it invites selfies :) [23:26:57] I thought we were talking about like 3d models from sketch-up. Can phones really take sterographic photos now a days? [23:27:56] bawolff: Some can, e.g. the Google VR-focussed tablet. [23:28:16] That's cool, technology marches forward [23:36:08] i can't find any links right now relating to the photo upload experiment [23:43:36] It was painful [23:46:03] *crickets* [23:46:20] :) [23:46:23] bawolff: but you are here! thank you for that [23:46:55] Today's question to ponder: If a build fails in the forest, and nobody is there for jerkins-bot to spam, does it still fail? [23:47:38] is any build a failure or is it just a learning opprotunity? [23:47:56] deep thoughts™ [23:49:46] I mostly have learned I hate putting a space between control structures and opening parenthesis [23:50:00] foreach( ... ) is the cause of like 50% of my test failures [23:54:19] i have to go now but it's been good to hang out :) [23:54:38] Thanks for co-hosting :) [23:56:36] You can always setup a git hook to run the code formatter against your patches before they are committed bawolff [23:57:29] that's pretty standard in the golang communities I've seen. just make the tools figure out what matches the style guide [23:57:42] bd808: Ideally i need something that runs it only on changed files. It takes too long to run it on all of mediawiki core [23:57:52] Ideally I could also do this for phpunit tests [23:59:29] the hook would make limiting to changed files pretty easy. you can examine the commit contents and modify them in a pre-commit hook [23:59:44] and phpcs should work on tests just as well on other code