[00:00:32] hoo: I guess nobody ever made a wikimedia client based on NNTP, which directly distributed wikicode, like if it were usenet [00:00:44] or which stored data directly as (x)html(5) [00:01:51] or on SMTP [00:01:53] instead of HTTP [00:02:02] and POST requests [00:02:05] and CSS [00:02:07] and javascript [00:06:32] galex-713: Read your messages in the public log: No, no one looked into such alternative protocols yet [00:07:30] would that kind of idea shock people? or at least would they still stay at the idea the web/browser is the main/standard/official client and everything else would have to follow and be less supported? [00:08:42] Web/ browser is going to be our main thing for sure… but adding on top should be fine [00:09:27] I did more think to add on side than on top [00:09:39] parsing web output would be ugly, not the same kind of beauty wikidata gives [00:10:37] hoo_: or, more low-level: exposing directly SQL access to the database containing all the data, with priviledge restriction, depending on the way you connected (for instance using AUTH or cert SASL auth through TLS) [00:10:54] or at least in read-only mode [00:12:06] We have a query service one can access (via a http API)… and dumps [00:12:39] a query service like in SQL? [00:12:48] why via http? why everything via http? [00:15:18] galex-713: SPARQL which is even more versatile [00:15:57] I guess it's widely supported and fits most people [00:16:09] you mean it’s SPARQL instead of SQL, and mediawiki does translate from SPARQL to SQL? [00:16:28] Isn’t SPARQL some shinny new semantic web invention from the universitarian part of W3C (not the corporate one)? [00:17:05] That hasn't much to do with MediaWiki [00:17:23] It has all the content [00:17:30] but is based on Blazegraph [00:18:22] what is this? [00:18:52] [01:49:59] hoo: you’re french too? // sorry, I meant: you’re francophone too? (that’s why I didn’t put a capital to “french”) [00:20:40] I'm from German… and frankly don't know much French :/ [00:21:33] ah okay, so how did you change the language to french to know it was “URL de la référence”? maybe I can use the same thing to see english messages/interface [00:21:46] unless some other french did ask/find/answer that here [00:22:14] that’s okay I don’t know much german too :P except some words of course [00:22:35] If you're logged in, you can change the language in your preferences [00:22:57] ah [00:22:58] if not, you can change it on a per-page basis by appending ?uselang=en to the URL [00:23:05] oh, thank you [00:23:26] I though I’d had to change the browser language, and I don’t know how to do this for firefox temporarily [00:23:38] Though I’d know how to do that with emacs’ web browser [00:35:53] hoo: what is blazegraph? [00:36:33] A triple store that can execute SPARQL queries, see https://query.wikidata.org/ for a nice UI to that [00:38:20] hoo: is SPARQL like SQL but in more developed and powerful? such as what XPATH is to standard unix paths? [00:40:02] No, it's not really similar to SQL [00:40:16] Go to "Example" on that page and just click one [00:40:21] it'll show you the query [00:41:29] it is somewhat [00:41:31] SELECT, WITH, etc. [00:41:41] it’s still a constraint based language [00:41:46] Yeah, they boroughed some of the vocabulary [00:42:21] galex-713: See "SPARQL query for the software licenses of the software that powers Wikidata" on page 23 of https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pathways-discovery-free.pdf [00:42:37] of the concepts too, it looks a lot more constraint-based/logical than imperative or functionnal [00:43:32] yuck, an orthogonal projection of earth [00:43:38] orthometric is better [09:47:59] hi, it appears that inventaire.io server IP (51.15.132.125) is in an IP range (51.15.0.0/16 ) that got globally blocked by Vito on 13 April 2018, 14:58 (see [GlobalBlockList](https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:GlobalBlockList&offset=20180413150000&limit=1), which prevents inventaire.io users to edit Wikidata: I sent Vito an email to try to solve this issue, but is there a way we could benefit of a [09:48:00] [Local unblocking](https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global_blocks#Local_unblocking) for wikidata.org? [09:48:55] maxlath[m]: I'll see what I can do [09:50:33] maxlath[m]: Do you need logged out edits or user registration? [09:50:45] or do you just edit logged in [09:51:12] hoo: thanks! [09:52:47] we only use logged in edits [09:52:51] Ok [09:53:43] Is it just one or two users or many? [09:54:01] (there are different options to exempt you here… either by user, or by changing the block, …) [10:09:38] hoo: potentially many [10:09:45] Ok [10:10:02] In that case I'll change the global block to only apply to non-logged in users :) [10:10:05] Good afternoon o/ [10:10:52] hey sjoerddebruin :) [10:11:11] hoo: that should do ^^ [10:11:21] hoo: do you know the cause of https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Administrators%27_noticeboard#Massive_replication_lag_for_which_Wikidata_is_worst_affected [10:15:52] hoo: it's working again, thanks \o/ [10:16:17] maxlath[m]: Nice :) [10:16:52] sjoerddebruin: Will have a look [10:29:37] sjoerddebruin: It's slowly recovering https://grafana.wikimedia.org/dashboard/db/mysql?orgId=1&var-dc=eqiad%20prometheus%2Fops&var-server=labsdb1011&var-port=9104 [10:29:42] Nothing we can do here atm [10:30:30] Okay :| [11:15:13] * maxlath[m] sent a long message: maxlath[m]_2018-04-19_11:15:12.txt [11:16:37] [reposting directly on IRC as it failed from matrix] [11:16:37] 2nd OAuth issue of the day: working with inventaire-dev consumer I get mwoauth-invalid-authorization errors, info: 'The authorization headers in your request are not valid: No approved grant was found for that authorization token.', which is weird because it worked for a year, but suddently stopped working. [11:16:44] the consumer page: https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Special:OAuthListConsumers/view/5ad72f099629357c183a1b850534c807&name=inventaire+dev&publisher=&stage=1 [11:17:12] Also, trying to refresh the tokens fails: the request to https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Special:OAuth/initiate redirects to https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Special:OAuth/authorize?Error:%20oauth_callback%20must%20be%20set,%20and%20must%20be%20set%20to%20"oob"%20(case-sensitive),%20or%20the%20configured%20callback%20must%20be%20a%20prefix%20of%20the%20supplied%20callback [11:17:40] where the following message is displayed: `Application Connection Error. Sorry, something went wrong connecting this application. Unknown OAuth key, [E006](https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:OAuth/Errors#E006)` [11:17:49] any clue where all this might come from? [15:10:29] It takes quite a while to fill in stuff properly. :( https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q28146737&action=history [20:10:08] 91,38% of subjects and 95,52% of objects being part of "educated at" (P69) statements have a start or an end date :) [20:10:19] * abian is happy with the completeness of Wikidata in many areas [20:10:53] I mean 91.38% and 95.52%, my Spanish keyboard... [22:17:28] which regexp flavor is used on wikidata? just curious :-) [22:18:34] SothoTalKer: Where? [22:19:09] for properties that check for "allowed values" [22:19:53] it will surely be PCRE [22:20:23] that would explain why it can't cope with umlauts (: [22:23:06] I don't see whyy umlauts wouldn't work [22:26:39] s/8 [22:27:35] Hi there, GF is being charged $380 USD to have a wikipedia page made for her. [22:27:53] Platonides: they are unicode characters, I guess: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Database_reports/Constraint_violations/P4869#Format [22:27:56] Is it true that she cannot create a page herself and have it last forever? [22:28:17] hello wadadli [22:28:25] Ello! [22:28:32] sounds fishy to me. [22:28:37] nobody can assure that a page for someone would last forever [22:28:56] OH, I didn't know that there was an expiration date. [22:28:57] the business of the person charging that seems highly problematic [22:29:05] there's not [22:29:16] OH. [22:29:20] basically, wikipedia is about building an encyclopedia [22:29:26] I am officially confused. [22:29:32] to have a wikipedia page, someone needs to be a person of notability [22:29:35] if you GF is relevant, she shouldn't need to task anyone to create an article [22:29:40] it will end up being done [22:29:44] if she is not [22:30:17] even if it gets created by her or someone that she pays for it [22:30:23] She is actress that was featured in a TV show, can she create page herself? [22:30:28] it will probably end up deleted [22:30:39] now [22:30:50] creating a page for yourself [22:30:56] or even someone you are related with [22:30:58] like you [22:30:58] Guy is charging her $4000 USD to create 350 articles that will get her onto Wikipedia. [22:31:01] an employee, etc. [22:31:13] is generally a bad idea [22:31:17] OH. [22:31:54] wadadli: is that guy disclosing that ? [22:32:09] if he doesn't, he is violating wikipedia terms of use [22:32:26] Apparently he's done this many times. [22:32:36] which generally end up with all the articles created being deleted [22:32:41] He's sent her the one's he has done. [22:32:43] he *claims* that [22:32:56] Yes, he's claiming that. [22:33:32] nobody does hinder anyone for creating a page about themselves, but since wikipedia is an encyclopedia (or tries to be one), articles should be neutral (NPOV), which can be a bit difficult if you are the person or are related. [22:33:59] I would consider it very difficult [22:34:23] when you come with the specific goal of creating an article about someone… [22:34:32] there is a very clear Conflict of interest [22:34:47] see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Conflict_of_interest [22:35:04] well, that could be said about anyone creating an article with a specific goal in mind. :-) [22:35:20] heh [22:35:33] starting by creating an article is hard [22:35:47] even if it's about something you are neutral with [22:36:23] but in the end, many editors balance it out. [22:36:29] sure [22:36:41] but it is preferable to start with smaller edits [22:37:50] wadadli: you or your GF should not pay, I would say. I also wonder how creating 350 articles will make a person notable. [22:38:01] wadadli: I recommend that she doesn't contract anyone for that [22:38:13] it will not [22:39:07] seems like an attempt to hide that someone is not notable by creating many articles referring to him/her [22:39:45] still, I don't know how he would manage to crete so many articles related a subject [22:39:56] probably all of them end up nuked [22:41:32] wadadli: if your GF meets the notability criteria for people as listed here, she can have an article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Notability_(people) [22:46:37] Platonides, SothoTalKer: unfortunately it’s not so simple, see https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Help:Property_constraints_portal/Format for the regex flavors used (yes, plural) [22:51:08] hehe, well, unicode char support breaks those umlauts, but they will just show up as violations and work anyway. [22:51:40] adding an exception for any possible char would be too much. [22:54:26] OK. [23:05:29] funnily that regex has an unescaped forward slash, but matches anyway :D [23:25:40] WikidataFacts: i guess the regex flavors don't support unicode? (: [23:27:10] at least the WDQS one doesn’t http://tinyurl.com/ybvjpkbe [23:31:34] Should it not be \p{Lu}? [23:44:46] \p{Upper} only works, when UNICODE_CHARACTER_CLASS is set. \p{IsUppercase} and \p{Lu} both return true. but it's very late. sweet dreams <3