[10:40:55] Hello [10:41:14] I have a bit of a general question [10:41:40] Are there plans for or thoughts about using the mediawiki Extensiondistributor in SMW? [10:57:50] JosefAssad: SMW uses composer to download some of required extensions [11:00:33] yep [11:00:54] I'm a bit of a mediawiki newbie, so I'm just trying to gain insight [11:01:37] I'm evaluating what the most trouble-free way of maintaining a MW with SMW and some non-SMW extensions is [11:02:13] so I see SMW using composer and for example AccessControl using ExtensionDistributor [11:03:00] that's two "upgrade" mechanisms. Ideally, one is better than two, so I'm just curious why SMW prefers composer [11:24:27] JosefAssad: Composer downloads automatically necessary extensions with correct versions from GIT [11:25:18] If a package doesn't have composer info, then it easyest to download/update them using git [11:26:27] out of curiosity, why git? Is there known issues with micing composer and mediawiki's ExtensionDistributor? [11:26:40] forgive me if the questions are uninformed, I'm mainly a python guy [11:32:21] this is definately some official anser, just my thoughs... well, first of all GIT is a distributed version control system. So when you clone a extension from distributor, you will get all history and version information. it will be very easy to update extension, just go to extension directory and do "git pull"; on other hand, when using tar archives, you need to manually download the new version, and then extract it, and it will [11:32:21] be a lot more work to switch between the versions (need to move directories) [11:33:07] and distributing tar archives takes up a lot more space. because a lot of data in each versions tarball is duplicate [11:35:21] and it seems like, extensiondistributor is only meant to make it possible to download the "installed" version [11:36:48] it will not download and install htem [11:36:56] automaticaly [11:38:23] omg, NOT an official answer.... damn missing word [11:40:52] I agree that git is a lot more sane [11:42:04] wouldn't it be more transparent then if extensions tagged commits or made brahces that point at MW release versions then? [11:42:17] s/brahces/branches/ [12:19:23] JosefAssad: extensions do have tags/branches [12:21:37] command 'composer require mediawiki/semantic-forms "*"' fetches the latest in master [12:22:09] command 'composer require mediawiki/semantic-forms "1.3"' fetches the version 1.3 [12:26:04] but, are the tags/branches pointing at MW releases? [13:22:12] JosefAssad: you can take a look... https://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMediaWiki [13:28:22] could be I'm stupid, but it looks to contain only SMW tags/branches [13:29:13] OK. Still useful, now I got an idea about how to track MW development as a SMW user [13:29:19] ty for your time Roland! [13:30:05] JosefAssad: every extension has it's own GIT repository, each has it's own set of tags/branches [13:39:20] yes, it's the relationship between extension versions and MW which I am interested in [13:41:40] JosefAssad: branch names in MediaWiki git and extensions git looks to be the same [13:49:59] the SMW branches? [13:50:28] maybe I'm not looking at the right thing here [13:55:40] JosefAssad: it looks like, it depends on the extension.... semanticforms has those branches at least, SMW doesn't [13:57:04] yeah that was my conclusion so far [13:57:17] makes it a bit less easy longer term to maintain a SMW [13:57:59] not sure how happy I am having to install composer in debian stable... *sigh* [14:01:49] oh wait, composer installs locally in the project folder and not globally? This is actually nice [14:02:00] (sorry, I have only experience with pip) [14:02:06] JosefAssad: yes locallly [14:02:27] ok, color me mess unhappy [14:02:31] s/mess/less [14:07:01] JosefAssad: I think the composer thingy, is quite new, and a lot of extensions haven't started using it yet [14:08:22] Does Anybody want to check fixes to PageSchema/Forms generation, I just made? https://github.com/roland2025/mediawiki-extensions-SemanticForms/commits/master [14:18:15] Roland: Didn't read the whole conversation. If you want to provide a patch for SF you should submit it to SF's repository on gerrit.wikimedia.org. If this is just a temporary hack for your particuar wiki, than nevermind. [14:20:40] Generally MW core developers seem to think that all extension developers should at all times keep their extensions up to date with MW head. They would then at some point in time label a version of MW and all extensions. Nice Theory, but has a lot of flaws on second thought [14:21:49] In reality you'll have to read through the extensions docs to find out which extension version goes with which MW version. [14:22:16] FoxxT: since I have never written code for mediawiki, someone should check my code! [14:22:24] This is made easier by using composer, because then the version requirements are resolved by the tool. No need to read all the docs [14:23:19] FoxxT: I imagine you're right that the MW utopia about extension compatibility is ulrealistic. [14:24:32] Roland: No problem. Still, please submit a patch to gerrit. It won't be merged right away, so no damage done. But it gives the devs a better view of the differences your patch introduces. Else they'll have to read the whole code. [14:24:33] FoxxT: I'm not a php person; how much traction does composer have in general? [14:24:49] (am mainly a python person, and a bad one at that) [14:25:21] FoxxT: I added some patches to bugzilla, do I need to move those too? [14:25:53] JosefAssad: see https://packagist.org/statistics. [14:26:24] Roland: No, should be fine [14:26:46] ty FoxxT, I appreciate your input [14:27:12] JosefAssad: As I see it, it is (or should be) the standard dependency manager for PHP. But I'm a biased fanboy. :) [14:27:49] yeah [14:28:06] I mean, I come from the python world. so there's already solutions, but they're bad in different ways [14:28:30] I'm just trying to find the least-effort way to maintain a MW with SMW and a few non-SMW extensions here. :) [14:28:59] guess it's a mix of composer and ExtensionDistributor [14:29:44] JosefAssad: I don't know the current state of the ExtensionDistributor. I usually use git directly. [14:30:09] Or composer where available [14:31:17] yeah I think, if ExtensionDistributor works, then that usually means there's a git tag/branch to use. In which case git's good enough for me too [14:31:55] and agree again, if somethings om packagist, I'll prefer that due to dependency management. The MW extension AccessControl isn't though, unfortunatel [14:31:58] y [14:32:12] JosefAssad: Poke them. :) [14:33:00] haha [14:33:06] yeah I ought to [14:33:08] goddamniot [14:33:11] s/o// [14:33:14] er [14:33:17] bad regex [14:33:44] ty again FoxxT, that wasv the sparring I was looking for [14:38:08] FoxxT: looks like quite a hassle to put things into gerrit, if never done before [14:40:00] Roland: Then maybe try the patch uploader: https://tools.wmflabs.org/gerrit-patch-uploader/ [14:47:57] FoxxT: git_review.cmd.CannotInstallHook: Problems encountered installing commit-msg hook [14:49:47] Roland: What are you doing? git review? [14:49:56] git review -s [14:50:12] I'm just folliwing gerrit/tutorial [14:50:14] have you installed git review? [14:50:18] yes [14:50:49] FoxxT: it tries to download something from https://git.wikimedia.org/tools/hooks/commit-msg , which doesnt exist [14:50:49] hmm [14:52:36] I think it could be worth just trying without this hook. When you call git review it should install it automatically [14:54:06] FoxxT: still fails with the same erro [14:55:58] Yaron: Hi could you check these latest fixes? https://github.com/roland2025/mediawiki-extensions-SemanticForms/commits/master [14:56:27] All three? [14:56:31] yes [14:56:37] Ok, quick and easy workaround: Use the patch uploader. If you want to get git/gerrit going, had over to the #wikimedia-dev channel and ask them what could be the issue [14:58:27] Roland: the first patch looks good; good catch. [14:58:58] For the second two - were you actually not seeing those field in the "edit schema" page, after they were set in the XML? [14:59:04] Because for me, that worked fine. [14:59:21] the field content was empty [14:59:29] field was there, but empty [14:59:43] even if XML contained the info [15:00:16] That reminds me that I still need to check in my own patch... I made a mistake in creating it, that I couldn't figure out how to undo, but I'll just check it in and undo it manually. [15:00:38] Were you using the patch I created but didn't merge in? [15:00:59] Yaron: what patch are you talking about? I checked out master, and fixed it [15:01:14] Ah, maybe that's the issue. [15:01:41] don't even know where to look for them [15:01:46] It's this one: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/160163/ [15:02:40] (CR) Yaron Koren: [C: 2 V: 1] "The SF_FormLinker.php change is an error, but I'll check this in anyway." [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160163 (owner: Yaron Koren) [15:02:47] (CR) jenkins-bot: [V: -1] Various fixes for the creation of forms and templates from Page Schemas [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160163 (owner: Yaron Koren) [15:03:10] (CR) Yaron Koren: [V: 2] Various fixes for the creation of forms and templates from Page Schemas [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160163 (owner: Yaron Koren) [15:08:25] Yaron: you patched didn't fix [15:14:38] Yaron: latest master in SemanticForms: editschema still doesnt work, Form is generated wrong. [15:15:27] my changes work better ATM [15:15:37] So, that's two different errors you're seeing? [15:24:50] yes [15:24:56] those same, my patches fix [15:27:35] Yaron: 1. edit schema 2. enter text before field 3. save 4.edit schema again 5. field is now empty [15:28:19] Yaron: seconds issue: 1. edit schema 2. enter text into before field 3. save 4. generate pages 5. 'text before field' is not generated [15:29:53] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/8QsqOQ [15:29:53] SemanticMaps/master 76f027a jeroendedauw: Fix path [15:29:53] SemanticMaps/master 94a8487 jeroendedauw: Merge branch 'master' of git://github.com/SemanticMediaWiki/SemanticMaps [15:32:03] Yaron: sry: dont know but when I tried again, started working [15:37:21] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/ZSFQ4Q [15:37:21] SemanticMaps/master 0ac2be3 jeroendedauw: Attempt to fix build [15:42:56] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/znwQZw [15:42:56] SemanticMaps/master bdfdfe4 jeroendedauw: Add missing dv geo version spec [15:42:57] SemanticMaps/master 2597c89 jeroendedauw: Add build debug code [15:47:28] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/5C8YeA [15:47:28] SemanticMaps/master fe2e4a5 jeroendedauw: Update build script [15:50:10] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/2AkRrg [15:50:10] SemanticMaps/master 48a14aa jeroendedauw: Remove dead global ref [15:50:10] SemanticMaps/master 43efdaa jeroendedauw: Make var names for convention [15:54:45] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/cctL9A [15:54:45] SemanticMaps/master 2fc7975 jeroendedauw: Bump to 3.2 alpha [15:59:22] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/wmmTBA [15:59:22] SemanticMaps/master ca7f402 jeroendedauw: Add compat with DataValues Geo 1.x [16:03:21] Yaron: I suggest one more fix: https://github.com/roland2025/mediawiki-extensions-SemanticForms/commit/6d6abde6af0fb72eae642f731c3614a8a730c8b4 [16:53:38] Roland: hi; I don't have much time today - it's probably better to talk about this during the week. [16:53:52] But it's good to hear that it started working for you. [18:14:28] if I want to externally save my data model in a semantic mediawiki instance, such that I can pump that into another new SMW installation and get the same structure, is there a recommended way to do that? http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Data_Transfer for example? [18:15:17] or http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Data_Transfer? [18:19:56] JosefAssad: Everything is based on the pages wikitext. This means you can just transfer the pages using standard MW methods. [18:33:46] yeah am experimenting with that. It works. MOSTLY. :) [19:31:25] (PS5) Addshore: Remove use of deprecated $wgPasswordSenderName [extensions/SemanticWatchlist] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/157113 [20:13:06] [SemanticMaps] JeroenDeDauw pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/_AGsmA [20:13:06] SemanticMaps/master 17bce2a Jeroen De Dauw: Update .travis.yml [22:04:08] Hi, I'm brand new to using semantic mediawiki. I've read a bunch of pages in the help section, but I'm having trouble figuring out how to best combine the individual capabilities into a standard workflow, to start entering and querying data on a particular topic. Does anyone know of walkthrough-type tutorials for beginners? [23:28:22] (PS1) Yaron Koren: Restored patch accidentally removed by previous commit [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160312 [23:28:28] (CR) jenkins-bot: [V: -1] Restored patch accidentally removed by previous commit [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160312 (owner: Yaron Koren) [23:29:10] (CR) Yaron Koren: [C: 2 V: 2] Restored patch accidentally removed by previous commit [extensions/SemanticForms] - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/160312 (owner: Yaron Koren)