[00:53:59] anyone know a good way to force a semantic query to update more frequently? (so I don't need to add a " " to the page and save) [00:54:26] using a semantic compound query with map display. WOuld like users to show up on the map shortly after they add their info. [01:08:49] drobbins: see here - http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/FAQ#Why_doesn.27t_data_I_have_just_added_show_up_in_queries.3F [02:53:37] New patchset: Yaron Koren; "Removed support for Semantic MediaWiki 1.4 and 1.5" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticForms] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36950 [02:56:05] Change merged: Yaron Koren; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticForms] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36950 [03:01:19] yaron: thanks [03:11:23] hrm, looks like google maps popups magically died on two wikis. [03:11:30] maybe a chrome incompatibility [03:13:30] hrm, map popups seem hosed in all browsers. That's odd. [03:13:53] example: http://www.funtoo.org/wiki/Usermap [03:14:47] It's possible it stopped working after the latest mediawiki patches I applied. [03:15:03] will check the semantic maps git log, see if I need some upstream fixes. [03:17:51] ok, it's a bit scary to update SemanticMaps and have it traceback [03:18:06] I guess it requires supporting updates in other extensions (SMW?) [03:25:16] drobbins: yeah, it's all tied in together - SMW, Semantic Maps, Maps, Validator... [03:31:05] yaron: should I start bumping smw and validator to latest git, then move to maps/semantic maps? [03:31:20] yaron: I am on SMW 1.8 alpha [03:40:37] yaron: updating to latest smw gives me this error: http://pastebin.com/zNLfi2tQ [03:40:54] yaron: will a maintenance/update.php take care of that? [03:43:52] I can try a Special:SMWAdmin database repair and upgrade. [03:43:57] I have everything backed up [03:44:50] yes, that took care of it [03:45:08] doing a repair and upgrade. [03:45:19] Alright, cool. [03:45:28] Sorry, I just saw this now. [03:45:41] 1.8 is go. [03:45:49] updating maps stuff should be easier now :) [03:46:19] I hope it works! I've been seeing some problems with maps as well. [03:46:36] open issues? [03:46:56] it appears the pop-ups disappeared recently. Only recent thing I have done is applied the latest mediawiki security patches. [03:47:18] I don't know if any of them are open issues - I haven't looked into it too carefully. [03:47:20] bumping to mediawiki 1.9.3 [03:47:22] ok [03:47:32] Oh yeah, popups in Google Maps - I noticed that too. [03:47:38] You can't get to a page from a map. [03:47:55] yes, that is the issue I am sort of hoping that bumping to non-alpha code will address. [03:48:07] will see [03:48:17] I hope it works for you... if it does, I'll try the same thing. [03:48:24] if not, at least I"ll be running on an actual release. [03:48:35] ok, will keep you posted. [03:51:46] yaron: also, I don't know if this is new or not, but maintenance/runJobs.php seems to have a default limit set. [03:53:46] yaron: getting this icky traceback after a maps and semantic maps update: http://www.funtoo.org/wiki/Usermap [03:54:40] JeroenDeDauw: I am using SFutils::getAllValuesForProperty( $property_name ) [03:55:13] and it returns unique values, but is case sensitive [03:55:17] yaron: let me know if you have any ideas [03:55:35] I want it to treat [03:56:18] I want it to treat 'Value', 'value' and 'vAlUe' etc as one value [03:56:23] how do i do that? [04:04:54] diflinv: dunno [04:05:12] diflinv: first guess is that you'd need to use some php after you get the values back to consolidate them. [04:05:24] diflinv: standard approach would be to convert all results to lowercase, then remove dups [04:05:37] yaron: HEAD of SemanticMaps seems busted. [04:05:55] what is dups? [04:07:40] drobbins: array_intersect_key($array,array_unique(array_map('strtolower', $array))); [04:07:46] I am doing that [04:07:50] but it is not working [04:09:18] what is it doing? [04:09:43] drobbins: I also tried trim(ucfirst(strtolower($value))); on individual values as they get appended to the array [04:09:45] I am not a php coder really, but in python often that doesn't work because some functions don't actually return the array, they modify it in-place [04:10:20] ok, the array is this one, two, three, one, two, three, One, Two, ThrEE, one, tWo, thRee [04:11:33] and the output with trim(ucfirst(strtolower($value))); is {One, Three, Three, Three, Two, Two,} [04:12:03] whereas with array_intersect_key($array,array_unique(array_map('strtolower', $array))), the output is {One, TWo, ThRee, ThrEE, Three, Two,} [04:13:29] just play with it [04:13:41] how do you know that's the output [04:13:46] what is your command to display output [04:14:32] yaron: so in my tests, HEAD of SemanticForms does not work with the latest Semantic Maps. [04:15:32] yaron: after my update, I had to pull back SemanticForms and Maps to Aug 15th versions which work OK together. [04:15:49] yaron: but I am getting an annoying warning on top of the page for map display now: http://www.funtoo.org/wiki/Usermap [04:15:59] yaron: other than that, the upgrade appears to be successful. [04:16:15] yaron: pop ups still don't work, so it looks like Semantic Maps and Forms need some love. [04:18:05] diflinv: try dropping array_intersect_key [04:18:28] diflinv: still doesn't work [04:18:54] but why trim(ucfirst(strtolower($value))); is {One, Three, Three, Three, Two, Two,} [04:19:37] the Threes and Twos look similar but they dont go away [04:19:42] confusing [04:19:49] diflinv: I think you have another bug in your code. [04:19:54] diflinv: can you paste it all somewhere? [04:21:32] sure, let me clean up a bit, the comments and shit... [04:22:31] drobbins: what's the issue with Semantic Forms? [04:29:33] yaron: the map simply does not display on the form. [04:29:42] yaron: all surrounding buttons, etc. display but the map area is grey [04:30:40] Ah, okay... but does it happen with the older version of SM, and the latest version of SF? [04:31:17] In other words, are you sure that something bad happened in SF? [04:33:09] yaron: I am running older SM, and let me check, I think I am running current SF. [04:34:31] yaron: this is with latest SF, older SM: http://www.funtoo.org/index.php?title=User:Drobbins&action=formedit [04:34:34] yaron: it's blank [04:34:46] yaron: if I revert to ~Nov timeframe, it works. [04:36:01] Okay. [04:36:21] Are you using the *very* latest code? There have been a bunch of changes in the last few days. [04:36:56] drobbins:http://pastebin.com/BLWdCX3B [04:37:26] yaron: Date: Wed Dec 5 05:53:06 2012 +0300 [04:37:26] Removed support for Semantic MediaWiki 1.4 and 1.5 [04:37:45] yaron: I can do a git bisect here for you if you like [04:37:58] yaron: haven't done one before, but would seem handy in this case. [04:38:46] drobbins: no need. :) [04:39:12] yaron: do you know what's broke? :) [04:39:17] No. [04:39:32] do you know what commit broke it? We can find out. [04:39:56] in about 5 mins. [04:40:25] No idea - although there was a big commit by ftrott that made a bunch of Javascript changes; that would be my guess. [04:40:31] I just need to keep reloading the page while typing git bisect good or git bisect bad [04:40:58] I'll test out a bisect, see if I end up on that commit [04:41:08] drobbins: ah, yes - I'm seeing the same error. [04:41:12] Well, that would be great... [04:43:42] yaron: this broke it: http://pastebin.com/tTWRAKSX [04:44:12] drobbins: fantastic, thank you! That was my guess. [04:44:52] diflinv: let me take a look [04:45:17] alright [04:47:33] diflinv: your trailing else and function are missing }. [04:47:38] diflinv: I think. Add a } } [04:48:11] ok let me see [04:48:20] on line 38 [04:49:48] yaron: any ideas on my annoying warning at the top of this page? looks like the semantic maps site had a similar issue in late september (visible via google's cache) but they fixed it: http://www.funtoo.org/wiki/Usermap [04:50:00] bbiab [04:51:45] drobbins: sorry, no idea. JeroenDeDauw would be the person to ask. [04:52:34] drobbins: http://pastebin.com/b3zMeYAN [04:55:07] drobbins: what do you think? [05:10:33] drobbins: http://pastebin.com/nbNhrMjg [05:10:45] where did you go man :( [05:12:35] yaron: Can you take a look at my code please [05:12:43] http://pastebin.com/nbNhrMjg [05:13:54] using SFutils::getAllValuesForProperty, I want all unique values (Case insensitive) [06:01:59] diflinv: sorry, was away [06:04:36] diflinv: you should be able to resolve this yourself, with some testing. Write a simplified php app first that does what you want. [06:12:41] drobbins: ok thanks for your help, I did resolve it [06:12:50] there were two return paths [06:13:14] and I was always applying the filtering to the 2nd one... [06:13:25] anyway thanks again [06:13:29] bye [08:39:29] ping JeroenDeDauw [11:38:21] Hi Im trying to include SMW Timeline Format [11:39:15] but it doesnt work. How should I run the query? I tried it with a template and a form but im not sure if thats rigth [11:58:50] Domerich: http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Timeline_format [12:02:57] I've read that [12:06:34] what did I do wrong? http://domerich.funpic.de/wiki/index.php/Test It wont show a timeline [12:08:12] have you even installed SRF? [12:10:40] I have but how do I know it worked? [12:13:34] http://domerich.funpic.de/wiki/index.php/Spezial:Version I don't see SRF [12:13:57] that sucks, I did as the tutorial said [12:16:42] a tutorial is a nice start, but you still have to learn how stuff works properly [12:16:51] I know [12:17:07] for some reason that exact line was missing. Didnt save it for some reason [12:17:18] now that I did, the whole wiki won't work x( [12:17:45] then you've made errors installing and/or enabling the extension [12:18:24] it simply said to add one line, that's what I did [12:18:32] then I uploaded the whole bunch [12:18:38] what could possibly go wrong? [12:19:28] yeah, the ";" went missing [12:20:27] This version of Semantic Result Formats requires Semantic MediaWiki 1.8 or above; use Semantic Result Formats 1.7.x for SMW 1.7.x. [12:20:42] that stuff's all in the docs [12:20:50] Is it easy to update? just replace the files on my ftp? [12:21:29] yes [12:22:30] empty the directory extensions/SemanticResultsFormat (or whatever it's called), unpack the right SRF files in that directory, enable the extension and confiugre it according to docs [12:22:58] I mean I want to upgrade SMW [12:23:09] since there seems to be a new version out [12:23:52] should I delete the old wiki first? [12:24:07] I understand all the data is storen in mySQL so that wont be a problem [12:26:15] first backup [12:26:22] then check that you've got a good backup [12:26:33] then get MW 1.20.1 [12:26:51] then overwrite all MW files with the new ones [12:26:54] then run update.php [12:29:52] thanks [12:32:44] how exactly do I run update.php? I cant finde it in the root dir [12:36:12] Domerich: I believe you really need to learn a bit more MW before doing advanced stuff with SMW [12:36:47] haha im the trial and error kind of type ^^ [12:37:11] well MW and SMW offer lots and lots of possibilities in the error area... [12:37:38] instructions are in file UPGRADE [12:39:15] that I see, I will check it out. Altough the replacing process already has started ^^ [12:52:24] well it sort of worked [12:52:34] I have to add back the extensions I guess [12:52:37] gtg cu [12:52:38] thanks [13:06:10] ping yaron [13:07:06] Hello! [13:07:15] Hey yaron, how's life [13:07:40] Things are fine - how are you doing? [13:07:52] very very well indeed [13:07:58] Oh yeah? [13:08:05] new employer, new work, including explicit work on SMW [13:08:14] Data Transfer and all :-) [13:08:19] Ooh, nice! [13:08:37] So you no longer work at... Sogeti, I think it was called? [13:08:39] question: how is the SMW et al. feature request process these days [13:08:40] correct [13:08:50] since 9/1 i work at BiZZdesign [13:09:09] That's really neat, I'll have to look it up. [13:09:10] Dutch toolmaker/training/consultancy firm for ICT architecture [13:09:25] Oh - so similar kind of thing. [13:09:29] yes [13:09:39] "toolmaker" as in software tools? [13:09:44] but here I get to work on architecture as a rule, instead of an incident [13:09:51] yes [13:10:08] BiZZdesign Architect, BiZZdesign BiZZdesigner [13:10:31] That would be quite a business card. :) [13:10:56] http://www.bizzdesign.com/tools/ [13:10:59] nevertheless [13:11:14] the Semantic Family feature requests, how does that go [13:12:11] I've noted http://smw.referata.com/wiki/Category:Feature_requests [13:12:27] Cool! I can't really understand a word of it, which is how it usually goes with websites like that. :) [13:12:28] but that seems a bit out of date [13:12:42] Right... well, there are lots of different ways to request features. [13:12:57] smw.referata.com might not be the best one. [13:13:06] I saw the call for feature requests in the SMWcon vid [13:13:17] Oh - haven't seen that one yet. [13:13:31] You mean, for core SMW? [13:13:32] thought I'd field the "more negotion possibilities" feature request [13:13:37] yah [13:14:04] but ideally it'd be used wider, since some features belong in core, some in existing extensions, some in new ones [13:14:18] Okay - I'd say probably the best approach for core SMW is Bugzilla. [13:14:19] so we really need some sort of community site next to smw.org [13:14:31] ah ok, i've an account for that [13:15:26] What would the community site hold, other than feature requests? [13:15:44] spam, prolly :-D [13:15:50] Alright. :) [13:16:18] but I couldn't say what the community wanted [13:16:30] I doubt adding another site would make the process any better... it could be that the "Feature requests" category/form/etc. should be moved over to s-mw.org, though. [13:16:37] problem with communities is that you first need a platform, and then find out what the community does with it [13:16:52] I don't understand that one. [13:17:07] well, mebby there's more need for forum functionality [13:17:18] Oh, I see. [13:17:20] how are you going to find out when you haven't one? [13:17:29] Find out what? [13:17:38] that forum functionality would be appreciated [13:17:42] Ah. [13:17:49] I won't? [13:17:55] there you go :-) [13:18:05] I guess that was a rhetorical question. :) [13:18:11] 'twas [13:18:36] Well, sure, anyone could create an SMW forum. [13:19:12] if anyone does it, it hasn't the same impact as when Markus/Jeroen/you do it [13:19:22] or at least endorse it [13:19:44] Well, what would you suggest - something on semantic-mediawiki.org, or a separate domain? [13:19:56] ideally everything is centered on/around smw.org [13:20:10] Okay. How about the software to use? [13:20:22] ah, that's thinking in solutions [13:20:32] i'm still somewhat musing on the questino [13:20:45] I see. [13:20:48] but to answer it already: forum software could be phpBB [13:21:05] Alright - that's the only one I know about, so that sounds good. [13:21:36] ok lemme put some community ideas on my user page in smw.org; mebby we can discuss around that [13:21:56] One counter-argument against it is that it diffuses the channels of discussion even further - we already have an IRC channel, two mailing lists, a Twitter account, a Facebook page, a main website, a community website... [13:22:20] You could add the SMW+ forum to that list too. [13:22:37] well, I'd counter the counter-argument: wouldn't you agree that a bit more focus is required? [13:22:45] What does that mean? [13:23:51] I can't see the connection between all those channels, and mind you, I'm a long standing community member [13:24:32] so if anyone new comes in: what channels will he use - will he even be able to find a fitting channel for his need [13:25:16] Well, those two things are actually arguments in opposite directions. [13:25:42] More channels means more confusion, but also more flexibility. [13:25:54] true [13:26:12] but what do the community members need the most: flexibility or clarity? [13:26:21] I don't know. [13:26:31] I think I do. [13:27:10] I'd say, you should send an email to the mailing list about it - see what people think. [13:27:22] ah, true dat [13:27:36] Personally, I don't think I've ever posted to a forum, but I know lots of people really like them. [13:27:57] I post rarely, but browse extensively [13:28:08] forums are much better for search than mailing list archives [13:28:13] Yeah, I guess I do that too. :) [13:28:30] That's true. [13:28:49] ok you've given me food for thought [13:28:52] Oh yeah, I forgot one more channel: wiki talk pages for the various extensions. [13:29:05] there you go [13:29:10] lotsa flexibility :-) [13:29:36] I'll write up some stuff and see if I can mail it in before the weekend [13:29:54] Thanks for brainstorming with me [13:29:57] Alright, cool. [13:30:24] Yeah, sure. I bet it'll lead to an interesting discussion. [14:55:20] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Merged master into 1.9.x" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37008 [14:55:41] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37008 [15:34:23] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "updated gitreview to point to master again" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37015 [15:34:39] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37015 [15:35:09] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Fixed failing tests" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37016 [15:35:43] New review: Mwjames; "Do I have to resubmit this one to get into the master branch now?" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (1.9.x); V: 1 C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36338 [15:36:37] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Fixed failing tests" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37016 [15:45:07] Are there any add-ons to allow users to fill in a form or something like that on a page and have it store per-user responses that can be used queried elsewhere? [15:49:36] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "You could do that. Alternatively we can merge it into 1.9.x and then cherry pick it." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (1.9.x); V: 0 C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36338 [15:52:07] Olathe: I know people have tried to create such an add-on, but I don't think they were succesful [15:52:30] wikis just don't behave like polling apps [15:55:36] New review: Mwjames; "Thanks, I beginning to like the test stuff even though it fails." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 1 C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37016 [15:56:33] Change merged: Mwjames; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37016 [16:01:30] Saruman: Ahh, OK. Thanks :) [16:05:07] Olathe: it can't hurt to ask on the user mailinglist though... [16:06:40] New patchset: Mwjames; "Consolidation/clean-up subobject parser class" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37020 [16:07:27] New patchset: Siebrand; "Replace deprecated wfMsg* methods." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/27055 [16:08:46] Sorry guys, mediawiki seems pre-occupied... [16:08:48] I've got a simple blog template that works fine. I also have a page that lists available blogs, including the title, the name of the person, and a preview of the text. I use {{#sub...}} to get some of the text to show, but that's not going to work because if I split the wrong thing (like a
...
), things go bad. Does anyone have a way to do previews that's safe? [16:11:16] Change abandoned: Mwjames; "It seems, I have to die one way or the other. " [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (1.9.x) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36338 [16:12:12] salquint: why would users of your blog template be tempted to use stuff like
? [16:12:40] but it could be a ''' without the closer, or a to pop open a window, or just a url not closed [16:12:43] engineers [16:12:52] blasted technicians! [16:12:57] yup [16:13:18] New review: Mwjames; "Nothing has changed since [1] " [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 1 C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37020 [16:13:19] Or they could be using the wysiwyg editor which adds plenty of stuff [16:13:30] ah, wysiwyg is evil! [16:13:38] yup [16:13:42] I'm getting the feeling there's no solution to this [16:14:21] salquint: why not have users store the relevant data semantically? [16:14:34] other than having a text field that represents the preview text and letting them fill that in cleanly before the free text portion [16:14:48] salquint: that's what I'd do [16:15:08] Do you mean with text fields Yaron? [16:15:09] Actually, I should ask - is this preview string always just the first x characters of the free text? [16:15:30] yes, the first x characters... that's the problem, it's the wrong way to go [16:16:00] You could call some #replace's on the string, to remove all the possible tags, before calling #sub on it. [16:16:13] so what if you prepend the string with and append to your #sub: [16:17:56] Yeah, I thought of those, but they get rid of the formatting. I didn't know if there was some clean way to call something that returns a clean parse of a subset of text, but I wasn't holding my breath. I think a preview field is a little awkward, but it lets them cleanly set the preview text. [16:18:28] I'd have to get rid of everything, like ''', since a missing ''' would mean the text after it might be affected [16:19:03] That'd lead to you building a mini-parser in your template [16:19:50] yes [16:19:55] definitely don't want to do that [16:19:59] This sounds like a good opportunity to create a new extension. :) [16:20:15] yeah, maybe. [16:20:23] sort of the inverse of http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Character_Escapes [16:20:52] If either of you have any interest in learning extension programming, I think this is a great one to begin with. [16:21:04] I do, I'll look into it [16:21:07] thanks [16:21:27] yaron, mebby it's time for me to start learning as well.... [16:21:28] * Saruman shivers [16:22:09] New patchset: Kghbln; "Amended several system messages" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37022 [16:22:31] if I can master bash and regex, then PHP shouldn't be impossible, right? [16:22:39] Definitely not! [16:23:00] Although I guess salquint took this one... [16:23:21] But there's no shortage of other stuff that's needed - speaking of feature requests. :) [16:23:22] By all means beat me to it, I've got other extension ideas to work on [16:23:40] I defintely won't be able to work on it soon [16:25:04] mebby start off easy, like doing maintenance on http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Awesomeness [16:26:01] thanks guys, take care [16:35:59] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37022 [16:40:38] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Make use of numParams method" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/21663 [16:40:45] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/21663 [16:41:03] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Revert "Remove use of Language::numParams"" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/28524 [16:41:29] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/28524 [16:41:31] JeroenDeDauw This was fast. I was just about to add you an MWJames :) [16:41:48] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Replace deprecated wfMsg* methods." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/27055 [16:42:04] Wow, 39 users in this channel [16:42:09] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "Thanks for the patch, and sorry it took so long before we could merge it :)" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master); V: 1 C: 2; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/27055 [16:42:12] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/27055 [16:44:06] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "We are now at 1.9.x" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37024 [16:44:16] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37024 [16:50:22] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Bump version to 1.9 alpha" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37025 [16:52:07] kghbln: I get mail notifications :p [16:52:45] JeroenDeDauw Ah, that's your magic. [16:52:47] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "bug 42324 Better support for sqlite" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/34572 [16:53:21] New review: Mwjames; "Thanks ... finally ..." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master); V: 1 C: 2; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37025 [16:53:21] Change merged: Mwjames; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37025 [16:56:20] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "See my inline comments on PS1. PS2 is rebase against master." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 0 C: -1; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/34572 [16:57:53] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Style fix" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37027 [16:57:59] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37027 [16:58:44] kghbln: any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. Never thought that would apply to email though :D [16:59:47] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticWatchlist] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/35202 [17:01:46] JeroenDeDauw I guess you never have telexed :D :P [17:02:59] hi what could this error mean? http://domerich.funpic.de/wiki/index.php/Hauptseite [17:04:32] Domerich You will have to run update.php or have a look here (step 4) http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Installation_%28de%29#Erstinstallation [17:06:42] I though I did it. Now that Ive included the extension I get this error message [17:07:08] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "Anyone remaining concerns with this code?" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 0 C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/34071 [17:07:44] where do I find update.php? [17:07:51] Domerich If you had done it you would not get the notice that the database table is not there. [17:08:17] You will need shell access. Perhaps it is easier to follow step 4 [17:09:24] will try [17:09:33] Domerich :) [17:09:59] like this? http://domerich.funpic.de/wiki/index.php/Spezial:SMW-Administration [17:11:27] Well there is an additional error around. Just follow the instructions to find out which one. [17:16:22] now it says nothing :( [17:16:28] I think I screwed my update [17:18:52] is there a shortcut for query [[A]] [[B]] || [[A]] [[C]] [17:19:26] [[A]] ( [[B]] || [[C]] ), something like this? [17:19:50] Domerich You can also have a look at the error log of your provider. [17:20:04] I though it is an first install [17:21:45] Then you will have to have a look at http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Installation#Upgrading_existing_installations [17:23:56] well disabling some extensions did the trick [17:24:05] I am now updating the database [17:25:28] Probably SemanticDrilldown was part of the problem. However good to here that it is working for you now. [17:25:55] Have to leave for din dins :) [17:26:00] well I'm not sure, anyway it's doing something [17:26:04] enjoy [17:42:58] Can somebody please help me with selecting pages [17:49:53] how can I query something like [[A]] ( [[B]] || [[C]] )? [17:51:13] kghbln|away: indeed [17:55:29] tograph: what do you mean [17:56:59] I want to do two queries, [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]], and [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop C::value]] [17:57:11] Saurman: Is there a way to combine them? [17:57:21] sure [17:57:22] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Selecting_pages#Unions_of_query_results:_disjunctions [17:57:35] I saw that [17:57:53] but the problem is, the query gets very big [17:58:16] then there are several directions you could go [17:58:23] one is to examine your information model [17:58:38] if instead of [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] [17:59:05] well if it's that, you can simply do [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value1||value2]] [17:59:21] Maybe we could do something like [[Prop A::value]] ( [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop C::value]] [17:59:42] * if instead of [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop C::value]] [18:00:03] * we could do something like [[Prop A::value]] ( [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop C::value]] ) [18:00:13] well that's simple: we can't [18:00:49] really? [18:00:55] really [18:01:11] can't use parenthesys in page selection [18:01:13] how come? its a very simple thing [18:01:34] ah, good to hear that [18:01:44] I hope you submit your patch in time for SMW 1.8.1 [18:01:49] lol [18:01:50] :-) [18:02:09] really it's not simple within the MW and SMW contexts [18:02:41] ok Saruman, thanks for help. But just to be clear, you understand what I want right? [18:02:48] sure [18:03:04] (at least, I think i do?) [18:03:22] ok then I guess this is the way to go, [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] [18:03:31] yah [18:03:37] that, or revisit your information model [18:03:37] * [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop B::value]] OR [[Prop A::value]] [[Prop C::value]] [18:04:00] Oh one more thing [18:04:01] or create a simpler query that sends its output to a template [18:04:08] hmm [18:04:12] ok one more thing [18:04:35] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Template_format [18:04:55] Can I easily do [[Prop A::value || value2]] with arraymap without using template [18:05:23] {{#arraymap: value1, value2 |,|x| [18:06:25] Can I use OR in place of || operator, as it confuses arraymap [18:06:44] I can't follow what you're trying to do [18:07:10] So I want to accomplish this, [[Prop A::value || value2]] [18:07:22] as selector in an #ask? [18:07:35] Can I use arraymap, and without using template format get that? [18:07:41] yeah [18:07:53] as selector [18:07:56] maybe, but hell, what an ugly hack you'd get [18:09:27] Ok thanks [18:09:42] I'd sooner do some looping with https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Arrays [18:10:07] fill an array with each set of results [[Prop A::value]][[Prop B::value_x]] [18:10:13] then process the array [18:11:30] and, once more, I'd rather revisit my information model, and ask myself why I can't answer the question with the given information [18:12:10] prolly easier to expand my information model so I can answer the question without such convoluted selection formula [18:12:31] My model is simple [18:12:40] the pages are in category:x [18:12:53] simple model, hard questions? [18:12:53] Each page has some metadata [18:13:16] Now I want to select pages in that category [18:13:43] with either [[Metadata A::value]] or [[Metadata B::value]] [18:14:55] sure, but the information model itself doesn't directly allow access to some aspect that your question addresses [18:14:58] and with this query atleast the 'value' is same [18:15:07] so is your question that difficult, or is your model too simple [18:15:56] I see what you are saying [18:16:04] ah, good! [18:17:03] Maybe my question asks a lot (I am trying to make query flexible to get a lot of results i.e. search the 'value' in metadata A, metadata B etc...) [18:17:35] dont know how to modify the model though [18:17:44] mebby it's valid, but it sounds counterintuitive to me [18:17:59] what metadata are we talking about [18:18:23] like search the string in Tags, Description, this and that [18:18:47] yah, still sounds counterintuitive to me [18:20:02] if my property value of interest is "180" I'd find it not likely that I'd be equally interested in pages with "180cm" and "EUR 180" and "180lbs" and "page 180" [18:20:22] they'd be very different things [18:21:38] Well, the string is 'love' and I query Tags, Description, Topic etc [18:21:44] if one page has as Tag, and another has as Description, then why hasn't the 2nd page not have as tag as well? [18:22:03] I'd think that'd be the purpose of tags [18:22:27] "looking for love in all the wrong places" [18:22:32] leisure suit larry :-)) [18:22:40] what? [18:22:41] * Saruman is showing his age [18:22:52] game in the early '90 [18:23:09] look mostly the tags exist in tags [18:23:30] but sometimes the tags aren't declared but there is some keyword in the description [18:23:41] so ask yourself: if that's the case, then what's going on? [18:23:51] or it maybe that love is a general topic of the page and the tags are more specific [18:24:19] Nothing wrong with a page's template automatically feeding the general topic into a tag [18:24:49] and if all tags do not contain a term that _is_ in the description, then the info on the page simply isn't good [18:24:56] but then there will be a lot of tags, and it also gets mixed up [18:25:09] well, SMW can handle all that lots-of-tags for you [18:25:16] no problem with lotsa information [18:25:26] only problem with lotsa unsorted unordered information [18:25:28] it wouldn't look good :( [18:25:41] let's agree to disagree on that :-) [18:25:43] besides that's the job of the description to contain the description [18:26:17] sure, but a description describes, and only does that [18:26:31] you want the wiki to also "interpret" what's in the description [18:26:41] even though the user didn't bother to annotate [18:26:49] and it is "counter intuitive" to have a movie page with movie specific tags, and then all of a sudden tags like love, patience and bravery appearing lol [18:26:50] what if description contains "no love"? [18:27:17] no need for the tags to be directly visible [18:27:46] but other pages asks for the ?Description [18:27:56] it is a property [18:28:45] well, from the previous I assumed you were going to try to find a keyword in a ?Description string [18:28:57] if that assumption is false, then the solution is simple [18:29:21] add a Tag that contains the Description, and you can simply search for Tags only [18:29:47] if the assumption is true, then you're really trying to have the wiki interpret what a Description might be saying [18:30:19] I dont understand your assumption really [18:30:22] try and find a movie with "love", get the movie that's described with "created witout love for cinema" [18:30:32] but Description is a property of type string [18:30:56] and I was searching the Description as [[Description::~*string*]] [18:31:05] ah, my assumption was correct [18:32:06] so whats the correct way? [18:32:21] do not search inside the Description [18:32:48] if a user enters a movie that's going to have to be findable by a couple of tags, put these in Tags [18:33:16] for other purposes, MW still has the keyword search box [18:33:35] just remove the description? [18:33:38] I'd say Description is not a selection item, it's a description item [18:33:39] yes [18:33:55] {{#ask: |?Description}} [18:33:57] well what about properties like topic? [18:34:10] That's a criterium alright [18:34:46] and I dont want to complicate the form, adding boxes for topic and everything [18:35:00] then you're stuck between a rock and a hard place [18:35:01] just a simple search box for keywords [18:35:10] That's already in MW [18:35:13] don't need SMW for that [18:35:42] but there is hardcoded criteria before the search [18:35:42] if you don't want your users to annotate a page, then you have no information to work with, other than the generic keyword search that's standard in MW [18:36:11] then have the user annotate the pages with these [18:36:32] like [[Category:x]] [[criteria1::abc]] [[criteria2::xyz]] [18:36:53] If you want to search for these: yes [18:37:07] and Semantic Forms with dropdowns and autocomplete can make things very simple for the users [18:37:31] yes I already have inputs for Category and other criteria [18:38:05] but there is only one box for keywords, which I want for Tags, Topic.. [18:38:58] I don't understand "there is" [18:40:23] The query form has one keyword box, which gives input to [[Tags::{{{keywords}}}]] OR [[Topic::{{{keywords}}}]] [18:41:10] again, sounds like an information model anomaly [18:41:32] why isn't the user selecting between Topic or Tag? [18:42:31] I kinda feel it too [18:42:36] oh well [18:42:46] being aware is the first step [18:43:02] and maybe you decide _not_ to change it, that may be valid too [18:43:42] but at the same time, putting lots of input boxes to enter topic etc is ugly [18:44:12] maybe I would just output ?Topic so people can sort it [18:44:32] sounds like a plan [18:44:34] be able to look at it and sort [18:44:45] work with the info you have, or get more info in your model [18:44:54] that's about it, I'd say [18:44:59] though in a million results, only a few topics would be able to come up [18:45:11] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "Looks good" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master); V: 0 C: 2; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/34678 [18:45:33] I'm glad that my wikis have much stricter defined topics :-D [18:45:45] whats your wiki? [18:46:13] I have several, e.g. on infrastrucutre architecture, and on government architecture models [18:46:39] the latter is generated from an export from an architecture tool [18:47:47] ok boss good luck, and thanks for helping [18:48:02] gotta go [18:48:06] God bless you [18:48:30] saruman: :) [18:48:36] you're welcome [18:50:37] New review: Kghbln; "See inline comment" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37022 [19:09:38] when is it a good idea to use {{#set_internal_recurring_event ? [19:09:48] yes ive read the docs [19:10:12] I need a better example to fully understand [19:10:24] dunno, I don't handle time in my wikis [19:10:33] okay [19:10:41] I want to store interviews in my wiki [19:10:48] and I thought this might come in handy [19:11:18] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Timeline_format looks particularly nice [19:12:23] It does, Im checking this out when my wiki is back up again [19:12:44] but I need to store information in a smart way from an interviewee [19:13:00] "smart" always sounds like a plan :-) [19:13:24] Person A: blablabla, start time , end time, mood, other crazy bullshit I yet have to come up with [19:13:43] [[Bullshit::Crazy]] :-D [19:13:48] lol [19:14:39] I want to do something with set_internal so I have one variable that holds all the information I guess [19:14:40] looks like Timeline format works as long as you type Start time and End time as Date [19:15:35] I guess [19:16:02] #set_internal is extension SIO [19:16:13] I think you can nowadays use #subobject for that [19:16:15] Also I have to find out what kind of information could be of interest in an interview [19:16:24] ah! [19:16:25] how do you mean? [19:16:38] that's important as it leads to an information model! [19:17:00] Domerich which version of SMW do you run? [19:17:52] all the latest stuff [19:18:03] that's why nothing is working so far but Im planning ahead [19:18:29] my database is being recreated which apparently will take the night [19:18:51] since SMW1.7.0 there's #subobject in SMW core [19:18:53] http://semantic-mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Adding_subobjects [19:19:17] so this suboject thing is better practise? [19:19:17] if you want to use #set_internal you'd have to install Semantic Internal Objects [19:19:26] not necessarily better [19:19:34] it's in core, so it's tied closer [19:19:42] I think it's the plan to make SIO redundant [19:20:02] well okay. whatever is easier to use for me [19:20:27] "easier" I'd translate to "with the fewest extensions feasible" [19:20:45] <-- off to coffee [19:21:38] easier to me means easier syntax [19:22:20] but it seams pretty straight forward [19:24:15] I dont get the multiple values per property thing. what would be a real example? [19:31:59] Domerich: on a page for interviewee, you'd record a property "previous employer::IBM, 2001, 2003, lead programmer" and "previous employer::City of New York, 2004, 2009, gardener" [19:32:05] dunno the syntax [19:32:49] {{#subobject:Previous employer [19:32:58] | company=IBM [19:33:08] |start date=2001/09 [19:33:19] |end date=2003/1 [19:33:27] |title=lead programmer [19:33:29] }} [19:33:48] that's the syntax [19:34:05] and ofcourse you can add |shit=crazy in there [19:59:18] brb [20:03:31] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/Maps] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36711 [20:04:06] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "Note that this will not be merged into my dev branch, as there this class has had a thorough cleanup" [mediawiki/extensions/Maps] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/36711 [20:08:34] lol thanks [20:10:03] ok good examples but not sure [20:10:21] whats this for: [20:10:23] {#subobject:mysubobject [20:10:23] |property1=value1|value2 [20:10:23] }} [20:10:43] is property1=previous employer in your example? [20:20:40] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Bump min MediaWiki and PHP versions" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37059 [20:25:20] bye [20:52:00] New review: Kghbln; "It is ok with me to also dropp MW 1.18. support with this one. Besides, will SMW 1.9.x be a LTS, too?" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 0 C: -1; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37059 [20:58:08] New review: Mwjames; "Please do not have a discussion about SMW 1.9/LTS here on gerrit. This is only to verify if the chan..." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 1 C: 1; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37059 [21:01:52] Change merged: Raimond Spekking; [mediawiki/extensions/Validator] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37108 [21:09:27] New review: Kghbln; "Fair enough. Still there is an comment regarding a "problem" as gerrit puts it. :)" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 0 C: -1; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37059 [22:01:54] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37059 [22:07:22] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "fix min mysql version" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37123 [22:07:33] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/37123 [22:28:03] JeroenDeDauw One tiny question: Are the changes, e.g. the ones I did today on SRF backported to the 1.8.x branch too or should I author the 1.8.x branch to assure that it will be added both to 1.8.x and master? I have to admit that I do not know the procedure [22:29:54] kghbln: get latest master and 1.8.x locally [22:29:58] then switch to 1.8.x [22:30:03] and cherry-pick the commit [22:30:06] and git review thyat [22:30:11] I suspect that ought to work [22:30:50] it seems SemanticForms doesn't have any branches.... [22:30:56] am I just supposed to always use master? [22:31:44] JeroenDeDauw Ok. Will try next time. So this gets things into 1.8.x and master?! [22:32:04] and I'm assuming SRF 1.8 is compatible with SMW 1.9? [22:34:35] Ryan_Lane I guess so. However yaron is not around currently. Usually each new version of SRF is not backwards compatible to earlier versions [22:34:54] oh [22:34:59] newest SMW is 1.8 [22:35:01] duh [22:35:13] This was acutally an answer to both questions. But do not quote me if they are wrong [22:35:42] Yes the newest are SMW and SRF 1.8.0 [22:35:52] ok. thanks [22:36:45] Perhaps I should poke JeroenDeDauw to either confirm or not what I wrote [22:36:58] I'm pretty sure that's correct [22:37:26] Me too, but one never knows :) [22:37:54] Things are so dynamic those days [22:39:18] Error: Validator depends on the DataValues extension. [22:39:21] for the love of fuck [22:39:22] really? [22:40:02] a support extension requiring a support extension? [22:40:10] why not just merge them? [22:40:44] This must be something new then. The latest release 0.5.1 did not have this dependency. [22:44:06] it would be really awesome to have a compatibility matrix [22:44:15] so that I know which versions of things I'm supposed to be using [22:45:49] As a matter of fact something like this is already in the making. However it needs some serious work. [22:46:33] I switched back to 0.5 for validator [22:46:40] no longer need the support extension [22:46:53] SMW and SRF use the same versioning. So this is pretty simple. For all the other extensions one has to have a look right now. [22:47:29] Yeah. SMW and SRF 1.8.0 work need Validator 0.5.0 min. [22:48:37] Validator 0.5.1 should work too, but obviously not the lastes alpha, beta or in whatever state it is right now. [22:49:03] The latest version of SF should always work with the latest SWM. [22:49:51] * Ryan_Lane sighs [22:49:55] well, it doesn't seem to be workign [22:50:07] it refreshed my ids [22:50:12] but now my queries aren't working [22:51:06] and no properties are showing: https://labsconsole.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Browse/Nova_Resource:I-2D0000009e [22:53:09] Looks ok to me [22:53:22] ah [22:53:30] I'm bad at reading instructions :) [22:54:26] Me too, to tell you the truth. Did you switch to Store3 or are you still using Store2? [22:54:41] hooray! [22:54:41] https://labsconsole.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Ask/-5B-5BResource-20Type::project-5D-5D/-3F/-3FMember/-3FDescription/mainlabel%3D-2D/searchlabel%3Dprojects/offset%3D0 [22:54:49] I didn't set store2 [22:55:02] so, when I purged/refreshed it had deleted the old data [22:55:24] know I understand why it was saying to put the config in for the old store [22:55:27] so that the data would still exist [22:55:37] :) So you must be on Store3 [22:55:49] yep [22:55:55] Cool [22:56:20] I guess you may get rid of the old store then [22:56:27] just did [22:56:58] How does it feel? ;) [22:57:13] better, especially since I was using a broken master version previously [22:58:10] Just a couple of hours ago JeroenDeDauw did some breaking changes to master. You were destined to fail [23:18:07] heh [23:18:22] yeah, prefer to avoid broken masters :)