[01:18:48] Yaron: Hey. [01:18:57] Hello! [01:19:22] There's an extension for getting the IP of a user called CheckUser. [01:19:56] Answer my question? [01:20:11] dretch - what's your question? [01:20:36] question is how do you know when you're thinking correctly? [01:20:57] dretch: You cannot be entirely sure you are thinking correctly. [01:21:20] then hwo are you sure of yourself? [01:21:23] how do you know what to say in response to my question? [01:21:29] Deep. [01:21:58] But if your assumptions are small, and well tested, and each step you take is logically verifiable, then your thinking is probably correct. [01:22:11] Yaron: The CheckUser extension would be useful on Referata, IMO. [01:22:36] Oh, okay. I think I looked at that before.... let me check. [01:22:39] so how do you verify your thoughts? [01:22:58] !hdss [01:23:02] dretch: Via small repeatable tests. [01:23:19] (Also known as doing Science) [01:23:20] how do you know these tests produce realistic results? [01:23:22] Oh yeah, I forgot there's no "alias bot" on this channel any more. [01:24:18] havvy - yeah, that's the one. I didn't want to install it before because I thought it might lead to privacy violations. [01:24:50] The default state of a wiki is to post via IP address. [01:25:36] And the only ones who can set a user in the check_users group is beuracrats. [01:25:43] Well, unless people log in, of course. [01:26:25] havvy - what would you want to use CheckUser for? [01:26:41] Uh, remember the mass deletion of the pixelnations wiki? [01:26:58] Vaguely... [01:27:19] Oh yeah! Somebody stole someone's identity, and started deleting everything. [01:27:33] Yeah, okay - CheckUser would have been useful there. [01:28:07] ...if only to determine whether it was the original person doing the deletions, or someone else. [01:28:56] Well, we also have a mapping of usernames to IP addresses on the website the wiki is for, so we could figure out who that someone else is. [01:29:44] Well, could have figured out...I doubt installing the extension now will automatically show that information. [01:30:04] I don't know how it works, so I couldn't say. [01:31:34] Oh yeah, it looks like it stores data in its own DB tables. [01:37:21] havvy - oh... it looks like the info is actually stored already: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgPutIPinRC [01:37:32] Let me take a look. [01:40:58] Yeah, indeed, the info's there.... I was wrong before when I said it would be hard to get at. [01:45:11] We're 99% sure who did it at this point. [01:46:31] havvy - did the user Unkajo produce any "good" edits? [01:46:45] Nope. [01:47:20] And the actual Unkajo doesn't use the wiki so... [01:47:37] Ah. [01:48:07] Okay - it looks like the same IP was used by "Unkajo" and "Jemmm". [01:48:28] As expected. [01:48:50] Okay, cool. [01:49:38] Well, I'm still not sure whether I'll install CheckUser, but that IP info thing is very good to know. [01:51:02] If you cannot trust the wiki admins with CheckUser, can you trust them at all? ;) Remember that the users signing up on the wiki already give an implicit trust in the wiki admins. [01:52:52] That's true... my thought was just that someone might create wiki on Referata with the purpose of ferreting out someone's identity, or something like that. I don't know - maybe that's paranoid. [01:53:09] It's generally better to err on the side of caution, of course. [01:54:40] Anyway, CheckUser is only useful in very specific circumstances, no? Like password theft and the like. [02:06:07] seems like Yaron has secret motives to find out the identity of a targeted user. [02:06:11] i wouldn't trust him [02:06:34] dretch - please go away. [02:06:45] that works [02:06:47] There are plenty of other IRC channels you can troll... [02:07:18] I'm sure others have long suspected of your suspicious behavior. [02:07:32] Look up my IP and tell me what city i'm in [02:08:12] Yaron: If somebody sets up a wiki trying to ferret out information, they're probably not going to use Referata, or even a wiki. [02:08:41] Why not? [02:08:47] I mean, I have no idea. [02:09:23] If you are smart enough to do that, you are smart enough to use other easier methods. [02:09:32] That's true... [02:09:32] Ones that don't involve getting a user to register. [02:09:56] Well, if CheckUser were useful for a wider variety of circumstances, I think I'd be less ambivalent about it. [02:10:29] I mean, this might be the first case since Referata started that CheckUser would have been useful. [02:10:29] It's your wiki farm, so it's up to you. [02:10:43] Actually, there might have been a time before this one, thinking about it now. [02:10:55] But that's still one incident every few years. [02:11:56] I got a huge boner [02:13:26] dretch - don't you have an algebra test to study for, or something? [02:13:38] Oh, yeah, it's summer vacation. [02:14:02] naw [02:14:07] you take me as a fool? [02:14:15] i said i got a huge boner, doesn't mean im in middle school [02:21:50] If there are more incidents, the less you have to work to maintain order, the better for you, no? [02:22:03] And if Referata gets more popular, there will be more incidents. [02:22:20] ooga booga? [02:24:20] allchan clear is fucking great. now i dont know what you newbeis said. [02:25:15] havvy - yes, that's true. I'll think about it. [06:31:24] New patchset: Nischayn22; "Remvoing special Sortkeys for predefined props" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16106 [08:24:13] New patchset: Nischayn22; "Implementation of Property count" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16111 [08:59:36] New patchset: Nischayn22; "Remvoing special Sortkeys for predefined props" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16106 [09:07:38] New review: Markus Kroetzsch; "Small change, otherwise looking good." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master); V: 0 C: -1; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16106 [09:16:11] New patchset: Nischayn22; "Remvoing special Sortkeys for predefined props" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16106 [09:44:14] hello all [09:47:02] anyone feel like helping a SMW noob? :) [14:00:30] New patchset: Mwjames; "Add fieldset class in Special:Ask (this change is a minor incision)" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [15:59:28] New patchset: Mwjames; "(bug 38504) Adds new result printer flot time series" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticResultFormats] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16047 [16:17:26] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [16:26:11] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "Use embed for small images in css" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16142 [16:26:46] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16142 [16:32:11] New patchset: Jeroen De Dauw; "fix for 905f670fea38b2ed6896be1f28665b92cb1ed694" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16143 [16:32:32] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16143 [16:33:23] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "So are you going to add the JavaScript?" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [16:44:45] New review: Mwjames; "The question is if we want collapsible to be a standard behaviour which in that case I can add the J..." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [16:54:36] New review: Jeroen De Dauw; "Either ask works fine without any additional config or it has the collapsible feature out of the box..." [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [17:16:37] New patchset: Mwjames; "Adds the JS for collapsible fieldset, credits goes to Yaron where the code was spotted first" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16147 [17:18:08] New patchset: Mwjames; "Adds the JS for collapsible fieldset, credits goes to Yaron where the code was spotted first" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16147 [17:20:38] New review: Mwjames; "This should solve the problem" [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16127 [20:34:12] New review: Mwjames; "For clarification, this change did not alter nor changed the behaviour of the sorting in Special:Ask. " [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) C: 0; - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16147 [21:25:23] Change merged: Jeroen De Dauw; [mediawiki/extensions/SemanticMediaWiki] (master) - https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/16147