[00:11:00] <AmandaCatherine>	 SPF|Cloud: I’m drafting my wiki’s local steward policy... would it be a violation of the global steward policy to include something along the lines of “except in an emergency, stewards should not take any action, ranging from basic sysop tasks to oversight and checkuser, without explicit approval from the founder or a bureaucrat”?
[00:25:19] <AmandaCatherine>	 *sigh* network’s being finicky.. rebooting.. be back in a few
[00:59:21] <PuppyKun>	 AmandaCatherine: I don't know if it cut off or if you set it, but I like how your ~realname~ is set to AmandaCat
[01:00:46] <AmandaCatherine>	 No, that’s not the way I set it, the unaffiliated/ cloak is messing it up
[01:00:52] <AmandaCatherine>	 But why do you like it?
[01:01:13] <AmandaCatherine>	 (I originally set it to just amanda)
[01:07:40] <AmandaCatherine>	 Also, PuppyKun I don’t know if you noticed when I mentioned to SPF earlier, but I’m drafting a local steward policy for my wiki - https://weather.miraheze.org/wiki/Weather_Wiki:Stewards/Draft - if you (or any other stew) notice anything that violates the global policy, please (politely) call it on the talk page
[01:07:41] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Weather Wiki:Stewards/Draft - Weather Wiki ] - weather.miraheze.org
[01:07:56] <AmandaCatherine>	 Shut up ZippixBot
[01:08:04] <AmandaCatherine>	 ZppixBot
[01:17:53] <Sveta>	 http://www.google.com/search?q=3
[01:17:54] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ 3 - Google Search ] - www.google.com
[01:17:56] <Sveta>	 http://www.google.com/search?q=4
[01:17:57] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ 4 - Google Search ] - www.google.com
[01:17:58] <Sveta>	 !http://www.google.com/search?q=4
[01:18:00] <Sveta>	 !http://www.google.com/search?q=5
[01:18:12] <Sveta>	 AmandaCatherine: add a ! before your URL to make ZppixBot ignore it.
[01:18:42] <Sveta>	 E.g. !http://w3c.org - another example.
[01:19:00] <AmandaCatherine>	 Thanks Sveta
[01:19:21] <Sveta>	 No worries.
[01:37:28] <PuppyKun>	 did not know about that ignoring it
[01:37:29] <PuppyKun>	 interesting
[01:37:37] <PuppyKun>	 also because cat > catherine no offense :p
[01:53:45] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun: so cats are better than Catherine, but your nick is Puppy
[01:53:54] <AmandaCatherine>	 How does that work?
[02:17:05] <PuppyKun>	 Dogs > Cats > other fuzzy things > everything else?
[02:17:08] <PuppyKun>	 I don't really know
[02:17:24] <PuppyKun>	 but I am fuzzy friend so expect me to like animal based nicknames more than human based nicknames
[02:22:51] <AmandaCatherine>	 Lol
[02:33:10] <AmandaCatherine>	 Anyway
[02:33:12] <AmandaCatherine>	 !night
[02:33:12] <wm-bot5>	 Good night, sweet dreams and dream of the miraheze servers without errors!
[02:48:20] <MH-Discord>	 <NDKilla> @Kian bug paladox over here
[02:48:35] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Ok.
[02:49:03] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> So... I just re-describe my bug again?
[02:50:34] <Voidwalker>	 it just doesn't seem to want to upload social profile avatars
[02:51:00] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Exactly.
[02:51:00] <paladox>	 Um
[02:51:08] <paladox>	 Wiki?
[02:51:14] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> https://weaslokas.miraheze.org/wiki/Usuario:Kian
[02:51:14] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Usuario:Kian - Weas Lokas ] - weaslokas.miraheze.org
[02:51:23] <Voidwalker>	 it works on allthetropeswiki but not on weaslokaswiki
[02:51:27] <paladox>	 Thanks, hmm
[02:51:45] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> There isn't any error message.
[02:51:53] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Just doesn't upload anything.
[02:52:48] <Voidwalker>	 isn't there a script that needs running when installing social profile?
[02:52:50] <paladox>	 Hi, try now
[02:52:55] <paladox>	 permission errors
[02:53:02] <paladox>	 avatars was owned as root for weaslokaswiki
[02:53:35] <Voidwalker>	 nvm
[02:53:39] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Let's try.
[02:54:12] <paladox>	 works.
[02:54:15] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Works!
[02:54:25] <MH-Discord>	 <NDKilla> ty paladox ;p
[02:54:35] <MH-Discord>	 <Kian> Thank you a lot. :D
[02:54:44] <paladox>	 your welcome :)
[06:45:36] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - JobQueue on mw3 is CRITICAL: JOBQUEUE CRITICAL - job queue greater than 300 jobs. Current queue: 2887  
[06:54:06] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - Puppet on cp2 is CRITICAL: CRITICAL: Puppet has 9 failures. Last run 2 minutes ago with 9 failures. Failed resources (up to 3 shown): Exec[ufw-allow-tcp-from-any-to-any-port-22],Exec[ufw-allow-tcp-from-any-to-any-port-5666],Exec[ufw-allow-tcp-from-185.52.1.76-to-any-port-9100],Exec[ufw-allow-tcp-from-185.52.1.76-to-any-port-9131]  
[07:45:35] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - JobQueue on mw3 is OK: JOBQUEUE OK - job queue below 300 jobs  
[08:05:46] <Not-683e>	 [02puppet] 07Reception123 commented on pull request 03#781: Import default.vcl - 13https://git.io/fNu7I
[13:04:11] <Not-683e>	 [02puppet] 07Southparkfan commented on pull request 03#781: Import default.vcl - 13https://git.io/fNzLv
[13:09:26] <AmandaCatherine>	 Good morning
[13:18:26] <paladox>	 !log reboot cp2 (to regain some mem)
[13:18:34] <MirahezeLogbot>	 Logged the message at https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Tech:Server_admin_log, Master
[13:19:19] <Not-683e>	 [02puppet] 07paladox commented on pull request 03#781: Import default.vcl - 13https://git.io/fNzt0
[13:22:05] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - Puppet on cp2 is OK: OK: Puppet is currently enabled, last run 1 minute ago with 0 failures  
[13:42:50] <AmandaCatherine>	 MacFan4000: I don’t want to edit war, but Flow, SocialProfile, VisualEditor, and a few others cannot be enabled with ManageWiki currently
[13:42:59] <AmandaCatherine>	 As they require parsoid/other changes
[13:43:17] <MacFan4000>	 They can, by us
[13:43:43] <MacFan4000>	 They are just restricted is all
[13:44:08] <AmandaCatherine>	 But you can’t enable parsoid through ManageWiki
[13:44:26] <AmandaCatherine>	 So even managewiki-restricted can’t enable them without hardcoding parsoid first
[13:44:58] <MacFan4000>	 We do that in the services repo, but we are working on scripts to automate it
[13:45:17] <MacFan4000>	 Al least I think paladox is
[13:51:33] <AmandaCatherine>	 Do we know if SMW will eventually be supported at some point (just saw T3407)
[13:58:16] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/mw-config] 07MacFan4000 pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzOe
[13:58:18] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/mw-config] 07MacFan4000 03bf917b6 - Staffwiki and cvtwiki config
[13:58:58] <MacFan4000>	 I would guess not?
[14:00:09] <AmandaCatherine>	 Meh, oh well. I pointed them to Referata if they absolutely need SMW, since that service specializes in Semantic Wikis
[14:00:41] <AmandaCatherine>	 Also, if anyone can speak/read what appears to be Polish, there’s https://phabricator.miraheze.org/T3344 that needs attention
[14:00:42] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ ⚓ T3344 Custom namespaces ] - phabricator.miraheze.org
[14:08:16] <Reception123>	 Well if Miraheze continues to grow IMO we could consider it at some point
[14:34:56] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - phab.miraheze.wiki - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is WARNING: WARNING - Certificate phab.miraheze.wiki expires in 15 day(s) (Sun 12 Aug 2018 02:32:16 PM GMT +0000).  
[14:35:10] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzsR
[14:35:11] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot 0374c6e87 - Bot: Update SSL cert for phab.miraheze.wiki
[14:36:30] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - wiki.consentcraft.uk - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is WARNING: WARNING - Certificate wiki.consentcraft.uk expires in 15 day(s) (Sun 12 Aug 2018 02:33:09 PM GMT +0000).  
[14:36:40] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzsV
[14:36:42] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot 03ce831a8 - Bot: Update SSL cert for wiki.consentcraft.uk
[14:37:12] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - wiki.zymonic.com - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is WARNING: WARNING - Certificate wiki.zymonic.com expires in 15 day(s) (Sun 12 Aug 2018 02:34:01 PM GMT +0000).  
[14:37:32] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzs6
[14:37:33] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot 0310c9b92 - Bot: Update SSL cert for wiki.zymonic.com
[14:41:12] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - wiki.zymonic.com - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is OK: OK - Certificate wiki.zymonic.com will expire on Thu 25 Oct 2018 01:37:27 PM GMT +0000.  
[14:42:32] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - wiki.consentcraft.uk - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is OK: OK - Certificate wiki.consentcraft.uk will expire on Thu 25 Oct 2018 01:36:36 PM GMT +0000.  
[15:00:31] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - www.iceposeidonwiki.com - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is WARNING: WARNING - Certificate www.iceposeidonwiki.com expires in 15 day(s) (Sun 12 Aug 2018 02:57:29 PM GMT +0000).  
[15:00:43] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzZ9
[15:00:45] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07MirahezeSSLBot 03a07040b - Bot: Update SSL cert for www.iceposeidonwiki.com
[15:02:33] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - www.iceposeidonwiki.com - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is OK: OK - Certificate www.iceposeidonwiki.com will expire on Thu 25 Oct 2018 02:00:38 PM GMT +0000.  
[18:39:01] <Reception123>	 MacFan4000: regarding https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Meta:RecentChanges/Community - do you know how we could make it show numbers?
[18:39:02] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Meta:RecentChanges/Community - Miraheze Meta ] - meta.miraheze.org
[18:39:17] <Reception123>	 Such as if there's one request for CVT it says Requests for global permissions (1) on the RC header
[18:39:57] <Voidwalker>	 not without manually updating, I don't think
[18:42:00] <Reception123>	 Voidwalker: it's definitely possible, see https://simple.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges
[18:42:00] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ New changes - Simple English Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ] - simple.wikipedia.org
[18:42:17] <MacFan4000>	 Unless you do PAGESINCATEGORY but then you have to have subpages for each rfp
[18:42:32] <Reception123>	 MacFan4000: not necessarily, look at https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_permissions
[18:42:32] <ZppixBot>	 [WIKIPEDIA] Wikipedia:Requests for permissions | "== Archived requests ==Administrator / Bureaucrat / Checkuser / OversighterRollbackerPatroller== Permissions ==See also: Wikipedia:AdministratorsThere are many kinds of special permissions that users can be granted. These include:Rollbacker is a user who can quickly revert changes by other users..."
[18:42:36] <Reception123>	 there is one request for Adminship
[18:42:47] <Reception123>	 oh yes, it is a subpage
[18:42:52] <Reception123>	 MacFan4000: well we can do it for RfCs at lesat
[18:42:54] <Reception123>	 *least
[18:44:00] <MacFan4000>	 Subpages that are transcluded on the base page
[18:44:44] <MacFan4000>	 We could do subpages and transclude each one on the base page
[18:44:51] <Reception123>	 MacFan4000: I added a category for the current RfC, but no number is displayed on https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges
[18:44:52] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Recent changes - Miraheze Meta ] - meta.miraheze.org
[18:45:07] <Reception123>	 Not sure if we need to complicate ourselves with subpages for now
[18:48:23] <Reception123>	 Oh, thanks Voidwalker 
[18:49:20] <Voidwalker>	 np
[18:49:58] <Reception123>	 I'm guessing MediaWiki isn't smart enough to do if threads > 0, display numberofthreads so..
[18:50:28] <Voidwalker>	 well, that would also include closed threads
[18:50:37] <Voidwalker>	 if it even existed
[18:50:57] <Reception123>	 yeah, but we could archive those
[18:51:24] <Reception123>	 Voidwalker: What I'm trying to do in general, is to find a way to let interested users know about community actions, other than just using a sitenotice
[18:51:31] <Reception123>	 Since not everyone checks RC daily
[18:51:34] <Reception123>	 any ideas?
[18:52:36] <Voidwalker>	 https://meta.miraheze.org/w/index.php?title=Requests_for_global_rights&curid=13603&diff=56037&oldid=56024 well, uhh... whoops on that typo lol
[18:52:37] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Difference between revisions of "Requests for global rights" - Miraheze Meta ] - meta.miraheze.org
[18:54:03] <Reception123>	 Voidwalker: haha wasn't a good idea to add it with HotCat was it
[18:54:26] <Voidwalker>	 but in response to the question, I'm not too sure how to get more info out there in a more available place
[18:55:45] <Reception123>	 I was thinking maybe a mailing list? There's not really any other way except that. For now I just announce it on IRC and Discord as well as a sitenotice since or else few people would see it
[18:56:48] <Voidwalker>	 maybe a mass message list similar to the site updates
[18:56:54] <Voidwalker>	 like community updates
[18:58:58] <Reception123>	 yeah, maybe that would work (since we don't have a mailservice set up anyway)
[19:08:37] <Reception123>	 Anyone know what's up with the "Cannot find section"
[19:08:52] <Reception123>	 I've been getting it so long now on Meta, but it's coming to a point when it's just becoming annoying
[19:09:07] <Reception123>	 I assume it's Translate causing this?
[19:11:53] <Voidwalker>	 yeh
[19:12:07] <Voidwalker>	 if it's a translated page, I only ever hit translate at the top
[19:12:26] <Reception123>	 Voidwalker: do you know if there's anything upstream already, or should I make a task?
[19:12:56] <Voidwalker>	 I know there's a way to avoid this, but I'm not sure what
[19:13:22] <Voidwalker>	 for example https://meta.miraheze.org/w/index.php?title=Stewards&action=edit&section=2
[19:13:23] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ View source for Stewards - Miraheze Meta ] - meta.miraheze.org
[19:13:33] <Reception123>	 random page here: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Data_retention_guidelines#How_long_do_we_retain_non-public_data?
[19:13:34] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Data retention guidelines - Meta ] - meta.wikimedia.org
[19:13:43] <Reception123>	 is it me or why is there no [edit] for each new "thread"?
[19:14:21] <JohnLewis>	 https://meta.miraheze.org/w/index.php?title=Stewards&diff=47610&oldid=37420 :P
[19:14:22] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Difference between revisions of "Stewards" - Miraheze Meta ] - meta.miraheze.org
[19:14:23] <Voidwalker>	 __NOEDITSECTION__ at the bottom of the page
[19:15:24] <Reception123>	 Voidwalker: Ah, I thought it was something like that only I was looking at the top of the page for that
[19:38:05] <AmandaCatherine>	 Hmm.. does anyone know why there is a global abuse filter (#12) that has block autopromote, block, and degroup in it?
[19:38:23] <AmandaCatherine>	 I thought those actions weren’t supposed to be used in global filters because it causes admin action to be taken on people’s personal wikis
[19:39:32] <Voidwalker>	 it's targeting very specific libel
[19:40:52] <AmandaCatherine>	 This is probably dumb, but what’s “libel”
[19:40:57] <AmandaCatherine>	 (We don’t use that term in Canada)
[19:41:23] <Voidwalker>	 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation
[19:41:23] <ZppixBot>	 [WIKIPEDIA] Defamation | "Defamation, calumny, vilification, or traducement is the communication of a false statement that, depending on the law of the country, harms the reputation of an individual, business, product, group, government, religion, or nation.Under common law, to constitute defamation, a claim must generally be..."
[19:42:18] <AmandaCatherine>	 How many hits does that filter have? I’m a bit uneasy with administrative actions being enabled globally, with no opt-out option that I’m aware of
[19:42:56] <Voidwalker>	 1
[19:43:28] <AmandaCatherine>	 Seriously? One hit since at least August 2017, probably before?
[19:43:40] <AmandaCatherine>	 Can’t we scale that down a bit?
[19:43:47] <AmandaCatherine>	 What’s the purpose of global filters anyway?
[19:43:57] <AmandaCatherine>	 Local wikis should manage vandalism/spam themselves
[19:45:29] <JohnLewis>	 the issue at hand is there's a high turnover rate with wikis
[19:45:57] <AmandaCatherine>	 Turnover?
[19:46:05] <AmandaCatherine>	 Meaning spammers hijacking the site?
[19:46:05] <JohnLewis>	 some wikis will be kept active by dedicated malicious spam - and if we can't see that, with a dead community we assume it's an active wiki when in fact it's just something over a spam haven
[19:46:44] <AmandaCatherine>	 Well, you can’t see it if the filter blocks it
[19:46:48] <AmandaCatherine>	 But disallow should be enough
[19:47:58] <JohnLewis>	 all actions are logged
[19:48:16] <JohnLewis>	 and all logs are reviewed by people like myself, Voidwalker, Reception123 and others
[19:49:19] <AmandaCatherine>	 But why isn’t disallow enough? Why do we need automatic administrative action being taken globally, when some people might want to deal with it themselves (i.e. me)
[19:49:44] <Voidwalker>	 because there is only one filter with more than disallow/warn enabled
[19:50:03] <JohnLewis>	 filters shouldn't take administrative actions except in exceptional cases
[19:50:20] <JohnLewis>	 this one case is exceptional and a clear case was made for it when it was made
[19:50:50] <JohnLewis>	 it would also be a matter that couldn't be handled by local admins well as it's a legal/TOS issue
[19:51:13] <JohnLewis>	 (requiring OS if said edit got through)
[19:51:20] <AmandaCatherine>	 Local admins don’t have the right to view illegal text for ~2 minutes while RevDel’ing it
[19:51:22] <AmandaCatherine>	 ?
[19:52:14] <JohnLewis>	 hm?
[19:53:12] <AmandaCatherine>	 Even if the edit got through, is there something that would prohibit local admins from viewing the content for ~2 minutes while applying RevDel?
[19:53:19] <AmandaCatherine>	 Because you said local admins couldn’t handle it
[19:53:58] <JohnLewis>	 local admins can view all content unless it is oversighted
[19:54:11] <JohnLewis>	 (or anyone the relevant deletion perms)
[19:54:44] <AmandaCatherine>	 But local admins would first RevDel, and if they felt it warranted OS, would email a stew?
[19:55:15] <AmandaCatherine>	 What warrants OS vs what warrants RevDel should be at least partially admin discretion of the individual wiki
[19:55:23] <JohnLewis>	 maybe so, but some admins don't know the process
[19:55:57] <JohnLewis>	 it usually is but when you're talking legal and TOS violations, it's taken out of the local communities hands because we as an entity are then wholly responsible
[19:56:36] <AmandaCatherine>	 True
[19:56:39] <JohnLewis>	 protecting myself legally is way more important to me than ensuring a local community has the right to decide if they think content is acceptable
[19:57:50] <AmandaCatherine>	 I have seen some wikis that are ultraconservative and will suppress things like “poop”, “dumbhead”, etc, whereas I’ve also seen wikis that will either only RevDel or not take action at all on things like email addresses
[19:58:43] <JohnLewis>	 we don't take action on things tbh unless it's requested or we think its dangerous information to have public
[19:59:39] <AmandaCatherine>	 Would you ever decline to suppress something like “poop” or “dumbhead” if it came from an ultraconservative wiki and you knew it?
[19:59:40] <JohnLewis>	 we rarely act based on initiative in suppressing content - we get requests and we evaluate them. If we don't think it's OS worthy but potentially revdel worthy but not urgent, we'd refer the request or the user to the people on the community and let them make that call
[19:59:57] <JohnLewis>	 I definitely would.
[20:00:14] <AmandaCatherine>	 Agreed
[20:00:33] <AmandaCatherine>	 What about declining to suppress email addresses if it came from a wiki that doesn’t consider emails to be PII?
[20:00:59] <JohnLewis>	 if it was requested by the user, I would
[20:01:22] <AmandaCatherine>	 Meaning that if the user requested that it NOT be suppressed, you would not?
[20:01:33] <JohnLewis>	 I would supress it
[20:01:44] <AmandaCatherine>	 Even if they didn’t want it suppressed
[20:03:01] <JohnLewis>	 if a user came up to me and said "don't suppress it" then I wouldn't
[20:03:28] <JohnLewis>	 there's no legal obligation to do it and if a user wants it public, then let them.
[20:03:41] <AmandaCatherine>	 Yeah, I’d think I’d be with you there
[20:04:13] <JohnLewis>	 the issue with privacy laws and regulations now days (esp where I am) is it's the users decision about what they consider personal. If they consider it personal, you technically must remove it or give a strong reason why you aren't going to.
[20:04:18] <AmandaCatherine>	 Like I said above, I’ve seen both extremes of wikis that think basic swears or “potty talk” is suppressable, and also wikis that don’t suppress what most would consider to be PII
[20:04:31] <AmandaCatherine>	 Agreed
[20:05:00] <AmandaCatherine>	 I’m not sure what the exact rules are in Canada, but I know that we are something like that
[20:05:00] <JohnLewis>	 If they don't consider it personal, then they've waived their legal right to data protection for the content
[20:06:39] <AmandaCatherine>	 I think that’s probably going to be the hardest part of drafting my wiki’s local stewards policy - is trying to weigh the pros and cons of considering different things suppressible or not
[20:06:52] <AmandaCatherine>	 Cause I don’t think the global policy specifies
[20:08:16] <AmandaCatherine>	 Speaking of which, I gave PuppyKun and SPF|Cloud the link yesterday and asked them to leave a note on the talk page if they find anything that violates global policy https://weather.miraheze.org/wiki/Weather_Wiki:Stewards/Draft
[20:08:17] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ Weather Wiki:Stewards/Draft - Weather Wiki ] - weather.miraheze.org
[20:08:22] <AmandaCatherine>	 This way I don’t have to change it later
[20:21:42] <AmandaCatherine>	 JohnLewis: I’d assume that for https://phabricator.miraheze.org/T3351 it would be $wgFilterLogTypes[‘comment
[20:21:43] <ZppixBot>	 Title: [ ⚓ T3351 Displaying Comment logs on RecentChanges and Logs by default. (for Usopedia (newusopedia.miraheze.org)) ] - phabricator.miraheze.org
[20:21:59] <AmandaCatherine>	 [‘comment=false’] in LocalWiki?
[20:22:49] <JohnLewis>	 that's for Special:Log only
[20:23:30] <AmandaCatherine>	 Oh, comments is its own special page?
[20:23:37] <AmandaCatherine>	 I thought it would be Special:log/comment
[20:25:33] <AmandaCatherine>	 JohnLewis ^
[20:26:04] <JohnLewis>	 it is Special:Log/comment
[20:26:55] <AmandaCatherine>	 So it is accessed through Special:Log
[20:27:10] <JohnLewis>	 yeah
[20:27:23] <AmandaCatherine>	 So why can’t we set $wgFilterLogTypes[‘comment’][‘false
[20:27:24] <AmandaCatherine>	 ]
[20:27:36] <AmandaCatherine>	 To get rid of the need to click “Show comments
[20:29:21] <PuppyKun>	 AmandaCatherine: there's a few typos on the stewards page on your wiki
[20:29:25] <PuppyKun>	 mind if i fix them while reviewing it
[20:29:25] <JohnLewis>	 you can
[20:29:41] <JohnLewis>	 I thought you were referring to the RecentChanges case
[20:29:43] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun: if they’re just typos, go for it
[20:29:56] <AmandaCatherine>	 JohnLewis: Reception already dealt with the recentchanges
[20:30:26] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun: it’s not done yet though
[20:32:59] <PuppyKun>	 ok i thought i saw two but re-reading it i only found one so boom just fixed 1 minor typo
[20:33:24] <PuppyKun>	 otherwise there's a few things that might be true (i haven't checked the user rights on your wiki) but if they are I dislike them
[20:34:51] <Not-683e>	 [02mw-config] 07Amanda-Catherine opened pull request 03#2312: Unhide comment logs on newusopediawiki per T3351 - 13https://git.io/fNzSS
[20:35:24] <Not-683e>	 [02mw-config] 07MacFan4000 closed pull request 03#2312: Unhide comment logs on newusopediawiki per T3351 - 13https://git.io/fNzSS
[20:35:26] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/mw-config] 07MacFan4000 pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzSd
[20:35:27] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/mw-config] 07Amanda-Catherine 0390f6630 - I hide comment logs on newusopediawiki per T3351 (#2312)
[20:37:27] <PuppyKun>	 so uhm anyone mind if i remove a few rights from stewards on weatherwiki 8)
[20:37:53] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun, which ones?
[20:37:55] <PuppyKun>	 Stewards should not be allowed to lock/unlock the database period (although I don't like it on wiki at all). It's a sysadmin action not a steward one.
[20:38:22] <PuppyKun>	 also although stewards (not sysadmins) are the ones that usually handle interwiki rights, I think all stewards are in agreement that the right should only exist on meta to force centralized logging
[20:38:27] <MacFan4000>	 And we do that from LocalSetingx.ph
[20:38:32] <AmandaCatherine>	 Many of them I put there because I’m not allowed to have them, and one of my biggest pet peeves is “permission error: you are not allowed to execute the action you have requested”
[20:38:38] <AmandaCatherine>	 meaning “no groups have this right”
[20:39:06] <PuppyKun>	 because no groups should have that right :)
[20:39:15] <AmandaCatherine>	 So why does it exist?
[20:39:32] <PuppyKun>	 Because other installs use it / etc etc
[20:39:43] <AmandaCatherine>	 Can’t we override it globally then?
[20:39:57] <AmandaCatherine>	 Like completely remove Special:LockDB and Special:UnlockDB so they don’t exist?
[20:40:16] <PuppyKun>	 I'm not 100% sure but I'm fairly confident that would involve editing mediawiki core which (I think?) we try to avoid doing.
[20:40:21] <PuppyKun>	 Makes keeping up to date a pain in the butt
[20:41:09] <AmandaCatherine>	 I have seen wikis use it occasionally though to stop mass spambots/vandalbot attacks
[20:41:22] <AmandaCatherine>	 Whereas our $wgReadOnly puts the entire service in read only mode
[20:42:24] <MacFan4000>	 Not sure it works with our setup
[20:43:28] <MacFan4000>	 But I think we could do something like unset( $wgSpecialPages["LockDB"] );
[20:43:35] <AmandaCatherine>	 in a farm like us, is it even possible to lock one wiki to stop an attack while leaving the rest of the service alone
[20:46:27] <PuppyKun>	 Yes? although we probably wouldn't do it with locking the database.
[20:46:33] <PuppyKun>	 $wgReadOnly can be set per-wiki
[20:46:43] <AmandaCatherine>	 Hmm, didn’t know that
[20:47:51] <AmandaCatherine>	 I’ve removed siteadmin and interwiki from stewards in the my repo, but I’m not going to push the PR just yet
[20:48:11] <AmandaCatherine>	 Personally I think that if stewards shouldn’t have it we should add it to the sysadmin global group
[20:48:16] <AmandaCatherine>	 Just in case type of thing
[20:49:46] <MacFan4000>	 16:42 <MacFan4000> Not sure it works with our setup
[20:50:09] <AmandaCatherine>	 Can someone verify that?
[20:50:24] <AmandaCatherine>	 Confirm whether or not it works (I don’t mean actually do it)
[20:50:32] <AmandaCatherine>	 I’m sure there’s documentation somewhere
[20:50:58] <AmandaCatherine>	 Also just a curiosity thing for my knowledge
[20:51:37] <JohnLewis>	 depends on your def of "works"
[20:51:56] <JohnLewis>	 does it work? yes. Does it cause issues we don't want? yes.
[20:52:56] <AmandaCatherine>	 JohnLewis: will MacFan’s idea of how to eliminate the special page completely work?
[20:53:38] <JohnLewis>	 uh, maybe but if you just don't go to the page, you'll have the same affect
[20:53:57] <JohnLewis>	 it doesn't show up anywhere, the only way to get that error is to go to the page
[20:54:16] <AmandaCatherine>	 There’s more than one page that will throw that error
[20:54:24] <AmandaCatherine>	 any page will if no groups have the right
[20:54:55] <AmandaCatherine>	 And like I said above, that’s one of my pet peeves. If someone isn’t authorized to access a page, they should be able to see who *is* authorized
[20:54:57] <MacFan4000>	 Or if you aren’t in a group with the right
[20:55:18] <JohnLewis>	 but afaik, if they're restricted they won't show unless you have the access
[20:55:22] <AmandaCatherine>	 MacFan4000: no, if at least one group has the right, it will say “the action you have requested is limited to users in group X”
[20:55:35] <AmandaCatherine>	 Whereas if no groups have the right, it says “you are not allowed to execute the action you have requested
[20:55:45] <AmandaCatherine>	 The latter I hate
[20:56:09] <AmandaCatherine>	 JohnLewis: they don’t show up in Special:SpecialPages but you can still search for them
[20:56:49] <PuppyKun>	 AmandaCatherine: If someone isn’t authorized to access a page, they should be able to see who *is* authorized
[20:56:56] <PuppyKun>	 what if it's intentional no one is authorized
[20:57:16] <AmandaCatherine>	 Why does the page exist if it’s intentional no one is authorized?
[20:57:37] <MacFan4000>	 It lists local groups with the right but not global
[20:57:46] <PuppyKun>	 answered above
[20:58:08] <AmandaCatherine>	 So why can’t we remove it the way MacFan suggested?
[20:58:12] <AmandaCatherine>	 That’s not editing MW Core
[20:58:21] <MacFan4000>	 I will try on our test server
[20:58:30] <AmandaCatherine>	 We have a test server?
[20:59:01] * AmandaCatherine is surprised by the number of changes that can happen in six months
[21:04:50] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNzQv
[21:04:51] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox 032fdd35a - Testing fix
[21:12:04] <MacFan4000>	 Doesn’t work with MW default Special pages it seems
[21:12:25] <AmandaCatherine>	 Meh
[21:12:46] <AmandaCatherine>	 I mean, is there anything inadvertently WRONG with having the right assigned to a group?
[21:12:51] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun ^
[21:13:13] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - phab.miraheze.wiki - LetsEncrypt on sslhost is OK: OK - Certificate phab.miraheze.wiki will expire on Thu 25 Oct 2018 01:35:01 PM GMT +0000.  
[21:18:34] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/services] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNz7q
[21:18:36] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/services] 07paladox 031e52e4b - Remove using custom domain with clonedeploywiki
[21:18:38] <AmandaCatherine>	 I mean, if you really hate it there, I’ll remove it and play around with the user interface to change/obscure/whatever it
[21:18:46] <AmandaCatherine>	 PuppyKun
[21:19:12] <Not-683e>	 [02ssl] 07paladox created branch 03paladox-patch-1 - 13https://git.io/vxP9L
[21:19:14] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03paladox-patch-1 [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/fNz7s
[21:19:15] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox 0344b9981 - Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no longer works
[21:19:17] <Not-683e>	 [02ssl] 07paladox opened pull request 03#43: Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no… - 13https://git.io/fNz7G
[21:19:41] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03paladox-patch-1 [+0/-1/±0] 13https://git.io/fNz7C
[21:19:42] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox 03a002fd6 - Delete wiki.clonedeploy.org.crt
[21:19:44] <Not-683e>	 [02ssl] 07paladox synchronize pull request 03#43: Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no… - 13https://git.io/fNz7G
[21:19:52] <Not-683e>	 [02ssl] 07paladox closed pull request 03#43: Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no… - 13https://git.io/fNz7G
[21:19:54] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-1/±1] 13https://git.io/fNz7W
[21:19:55] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox 03954b250 - Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no… (#43) * Remove clonedeploy custom domain ssl cert as domain has expired or no longer works * Delete wiki.clonedeploy.org.crt
[21:20:24] <Voidwalker>	 I mean, I think anyone with access to those perms on your wiki is responsible enough not to break things using them
[21:21:24] <AmandaCatherine>	 And since only the steward group has the perms, and the steward group is usually empty...
[21:21:28] <AmandaCatherine>	 ..yeah
[21:23:44] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - Puppet on cp4 is CRITICAL: CRITICAL: Puppet has 1 failures. Last run 2 minutes ago with 1 failures. Failed resources (up to 3 shown): File[wiki.clonedeploy.org]  
[21:25:40] <Not-683e>	 [02ssl] 07paladox deleted branch 03paladox-patch-1 - 13https://git.io/vxP9L
[21:25:41] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/ssl] 07paladox deleted branch 03paladox-patch-1
[21:25:54] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - Puppet on cp5 is CRITICAL: CRITICAL: Puppet has 1 failures. Last run 3 minutes ago with 1 failures. Failed resources (up to 3 shown): File[wiki.clonedeploy.org]  
[21:27:46] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - Puppet on test1 is CRITICAL: CRITICAL: Puppet has 1 failures. Last run 2 minutes ago with 1 failures. Failed resources (up to 3 shown): File[wiki.clonedeploy.org]  
[21:27:54] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - Puppet on cp5 is OK: OK: Puppet is currently enabled, last run 1 minute ago with 0 failures  
[21:28:34] <AmandaCatherine>	 BBL
[21:35:44] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - Puppet on test1 is OK: OK: Puppet is currently enabled, last run 1 second ago with 0 failures  
[21:53:59] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03stdlib-upgrade [+101/-34/±475] 13https://git.io/fNzdM
[21:54:01] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox 03f9d25c0 - Upgrade stdlib to 4.25.1
[21:54:02] <Not-683e>	 [02puppet] 07paladox created branch 03stdlib-upgrade - 13https://git.io/vbiAS
[22:10:17] <Wiki-1776>	 hello
[22:11:12] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox pushed 031 commit to 03master [+101/-34/±475] 13https://git.io/fNzFj
[22:11:47] <Not-683e>	 [02puppet] 07paladox deleted branch 03stdlib-upgrade - 13https://git.io/vbiAS
[22:11:48] <Not-683e>	 [02miraheze/puppet] 07paladox deleted branch 03stdlib-upgrade
[23:09:45] <icinga-miraheze>	 PROBLEM - Puppet on test1 is CRITICAL: CRITICAL: Puppet has 1 failures. Last run 2 minutes ago with 1 failures. Failed resources (up to 3 shown): Exec[git_pull_MediaWiki core]  
[23:12:11] <Wiki-1776>	 if you can make a public Wiki not appear in search engines? with index in Github?
[23:15:45] <icinga-miraheze>	 RECOVERY - Puppet on test1 is OK: OK: Puppet is currently enabled, last run 6 seconds ago with 0 failures  
[23:59:18] <AmandaCatherine>	 Good evening from a very stormy Ottawa